Blair Hornstine Project Comments

Previous Comments

To read comments from previous months, check out the following links.

Adam, I love the exclusive trailer! LOL LOL LOL. Thanks for your wonderful web page. Take care. Best regards,

--posted by Da Hamster @ Sunday, June 8 2003, 3:23 am EDT

Blast! I wish my Tungsten could play QT movies... Now I have to wait until Tuesday to see it! *grin* By the way: Thank you for explaining the GPA/SAT system! ;-) Lo

--posted by Lo Szabo @ Sunday, June 8 2003, 12:56 pm EDT

GREAT job on the site! Can't wait to watch the trailer (got to wait until I get home).

--posted by Kimberly @ Monday, June 9 2003, 17:20 pm EDT

..I am a 'Burlington County' (NJ) resident, only minutes from Moorestown..
Moreover, had I been aware of this 'Hornstine Thing' if you will, I would
have suggested that the *Moorestown School District' risk the '$2.7m' and,
continue with the *Co-Valedictorian scheme!.. Given the 'outcry' about the
suit (against Moorestown District) as presented, I trust that "no jury would
rule in favor of Hornstine" anyway.. Especially in light of 'higher school
taxes' shared by us all, and surely,.. any fodder (frivilous suits) that may
contribute to 'even more' perhaps!..

..Secondly, it was 'PLAGIARISM' that indeed brought *Senator Joseph Biden's
(Delaware) presidential bid to a halt if you recall.. I (being a bit dense
for the moment here perhaps, or may be that I am not after all,..) never even
heard of 'Hornstine' until this flap!.. Meaning; they say (at least some of
the publications, in example: newspapers-web, etc.) that 'her father' (Blair
Hornstine's) is a "high ranking judge" so to speak!.. I guess I've been in
'a vacuum' the last 8 years while working on my many web sites that I present
out here (*www.mattymidura.com - *www.mattymidura.com/shark_attack.html -
*www.mattymidura.com/court_tv.html for examples) really.. In the end, I'm sure,
that *Harvard will perhaps rescind acceptance!.. Surely, they (Administrators)
are 'fully aware' of all of this, and the 'media attention' that is evident.
No doubt too,.. they are exploring 'all options' carefully!..

--posted by Matty Midura @ Tuesday, June 10 2003, 11:07 am EDT

Your website is amusing but despite this,there are some REAL CLEAR ERRORS in your reporting.(Is that WORSE than plagiarizing???) If you read the entire 43 pages issued by Judge Wolfson or were at the hearing, you would know that Blair took LESS AP courses than Kenney Mirkin. When the Judge compared the courses that both took, Blair received more A's than Kenny.Therefore, the PhysEd courses ( Blair submitted a 12 page paper each year in lieu of participating, for which she only received a PhysEd credit)were not the SMOKING GUN that caused this media circus. If you were one of the reporters in the courtroom or part of the meetings that took part at the school, you would realize that Kenny's Mother was the one who was ranting and raving in both places. I am aware that this media circus has been played out in the press, tv and the internet by "interested citizens" who would rather gossip, and make up stories than tell the truth. What fun would that be? Whatever the results of this campaign, I wonder how many of these righteous people will hide in their beer if it comes out that her chronic fatigue syndrome was the term being used to protect a child (after all this started in or before ninth grade)from being discriminated upon by classmates or from the real truth disease. Now put that in you pipe...

--posted by Mrs. Moorestown Mom '03 @ Wednesday, June 11 2003, 0:21 am EDT

Mrs. Moorestown Mom '03:

Thank you for your post! Do you have a copy of the complete 43-page ruling from Judge Wolfson? I'm sure everyone would like to see all of the facts presented.

If more information was made available, perhaps I will change my opinion on the subject.

-adam

--posted by Adam @ Wednesday, June 11 2003, 0:48 am EDT

Unfortunately, at the moment, I do not have a copy of the ruling. However, it is PUBLIC information. You can obtain it yourself through the court system and possibly over the internet. You can possibly also obtain it through your local newspaper, the Camden Courier Post or the Philadelphia Inquirer. The FACTS have been presented over and over, however, it seems that the "public" likes a "good" story and writing only negative thoughts helps one encounter more negative thoughts.I have read over and over some thoughts from people who say they are "in the know"
that are so far fetched that it takes a serious story to the bounds of "fantasy."

I hope you get the complete ruling. Please, then write back. I am so sure you will have different thoughts.

--posted by Mrs. M.M. @ Wednesday, June 11 2003, 12:30 pm EDT

You go girl...Mama Mrs. MM has got it right. And how do I know. I am in that class.

--posted by Leotyne @ Wednesday, June 11 2003, 12:53 pm EDT

I DO NOT THINK THAT YOU ARE VINDICTIVE. I DO BELIEVE THAT YOU WRITE YOUR BLOG FOR CONVERSATION, ETC.. BUT LET'S WRITE ABOUT TRUTH. IN TODAY'S PHILADELPHIA, PA. NEWSPAPERS, THERE ARE TWO LETTERS TO THE EDITOR THAT I HAVE COPIED HERE ( does that count as plagiarism?)PLEASE READ THEM IN ADDITION TO YOUR READING THE JUDGES DECISION. THEN, PLEASE LET ME AND YOUR READERS HEAR FROM YOU.

Valedictorian not to blame

Regarding the so-called fresh issue that cropped up about Blair Hornstine, the Moorestown High School valedictorian, your headline in the June 5 Chester County section ("Fresh issue is surrounding valedictorian in New Jersey") was inaccurate. It should have read "Non-issue surrounding valedictorian in New Jersey."

If I read the article correctly, the young lady wrote the stories and essays. She didn't edit them. If there is a cry going throughout the land about facts and accountability, why didn't Carl Lovern of the Courier-Post newspaper come out and say the paper was looking at the editorial staff for letting an unsubstantiated article reach publication - rather than seeming to blame a 17-year-old for such a mistake.

This whole situation is becoming increasingly childish and petty. Isn't this about school performance, not who doesn't like whom and who has some ax to grind?

Charlie Silvestri

Vineland, N.J.

Do not mistreat Hornstine

The harassment of Blair Hornstine in the wake of her lawsuit against the Moorestown High School is shameful.

No matter how people view her actions, they have no right to torment, threaten or otherwise mistreat her. By resorting to these tactics, her opponents have sunk to the level of schoolyard bullies and hate groups.

The harassment has not been limited to Hornstine herself. After writing a letter to The Inquirer in support of her, I have received several hostile e-mails from her opponents. Although I am certain that not all of her opponents endorse these tactics, their refusal to vigorously condemn them has discredited their position.

Michael P. Gallen

Philadelphia

--posted by M MM @ Wednesday, June 11 2003, 13:09 pm EDT

GREAT IDEA. BAD FOLLOW THRU.

--posted by CHRIS WALLACE @ Wednesday, June 11 2003, 19:53 pm EDT

I write this as one who found myself in a fairly similar situation as Hornstine: I had the highest GPA in my class (due to taking more AP classes than anyone), but "had to" share the honor of being valedictorian with several of my peers/friends who also had straight A's. (I put "had to" in quotes here because I was entirely happy and honored to do so).

If Hornstine had in fact taken less AP classes and still garnered more A's than Kenneth, resulting in a higher GPA, I'd have *slightly* more sympathy for her. Never mind that such a scenario would show yet another injustice in schools' valedictorian selection process: one student (Hornstine) had an easier workload by taking less AP classes, but because she had a slightly higher GPA, she, by school rules, is the "most deserving" of being valedictorian?? Taking a less strenuous workload would likely have meant she had more time to concentrate on all of her classes, which could have contributed to getting more A's...

Gripes about the fairness of GPA calculation/significance aside, it is a fact that Hornstine had the highest GPA of anyone--I don't dispute that. My main objection, however--and I believe most peoples'--is in regards to the actions Hornstine took once the principal of the school, arbitrarily or non-arbitrarily, decided to allow two other students to share valediction with her. Is it really so important to be the SOLE valedictorian that one would sue her own school?? Was it such an DISHONOR to have to share the stage with two other accomplished peers? (For heaven's sake, they all had GPA's WAY over 4.0!) Even if she couldn't help feeling the principal "miffed" her, was it too hard to put aside her own feelings for the sake of making the other two accomplished peers and their parents feel better (that they'd get to be valedictorian also? And finally, was the principal's action so HARSH that it was worth trying to PUNISH the school system for 2.5 MILLION DOLLARS??? (Schools are already completely strapped for cash, esp. with all the state and federal budget cuts taking place in this economy. By "punishing" the school, was was not just punishing the principal, or Kenneth, but also, the hundreds of others who would have otherwise benefitted from those funds.)

To each of the questions above, but I'd answer "no, no, no, and no!"

Hornstine rationalized suing not because of her father, but because of her principles. What about the principle of not initiating frivolous, petty lawsuits? What about the principle of "think of others, not just of yourself?" (It's not like the principal was "taking away" her valediction, and it's not like anyone was disputing she had the highest GPA or rank. The principal had merely decided, wisely or unwisely, that two other accomplished peers would be valedictorian too. The latter was worth getting all mad about and suing over?? Was it not enough for her to be a valedictorian, and to know in her heart that she had the highest GPA, despite her disability?

Finally, that she clearly felt that she was most deserving of being the only valedictorian just because she had the highest GPA is, to me, somewhat offensive. Again, as I briefly alluded to in the 2nd paragraph above, the GPA process is hardly always "fair". There are several possible scenarios exposing major injustices in schools' GPA system.

For example, take two straight-A students who took 7 AP classes each, but one took 21 non-AP classes, and the other took 22 non-AP classes. Who would have the higher GPA, and hence be the valedictorian? It would be the one who took 21 non-AP classes, *even though both students got straight-As, and the other student took more classes and hence, presumably, had to do more work*! This clearly underscores how unjust GPA calculation can be, and that it is arrogant for one to think "I had the highest GPA; therefore, I MUST be the most deserving of being the valedictorian, and nobody better change the rules so that other people will share the stage with me."

--posted by Felix @ Wednesday, June 11 2003, 22:22 pm EDT

Blair Horstine has used the courts to get her own way. Do you think the judge hearing the case would have ruled differently if Blairs father was not a fellow jurist? These kinds of abuse have been going on for years, the valedictorian at my daughters graduation had "cooking class" removed from his record because he did not do well, members of the BOE's children all mysteriously ended up in the top 10 and last year my son's class valedictorian had got caught cheating red-handed but again board of ed-ism came through and she remained at the top. The teacher who accused her of cheating, however, lost his job. Things like this have gone on forever and will continue to do so. If these people need to be at the top, let them. We all know how they got there (they do too!)

--posted by Parent whose been there @ Wednesday, June 11 2003, 23:24 pm EDT

A friend of mine from North Jersey told me to read your column. This message is a first for me.

Felix, obviously you do not know that the superintentent, Mr. Kadri, wrote one letter to one student telling him that he was the student "being considered" for the valedictorian. That student was Kenny Mirkin, who had the big mouth mother who complained. Ms. Hornstine had the highest average, she was never being considered for the valedictorian and was NEVER ASKED TO SHARE IT. That is really what this whole case is about.She had said over and over that she would have shared it in a minute, if given the opportunity. The case came about because she was never even being considered. You will have either to believe me or get it from others, like the trial record, who know. For those of you that read all the facts, you will see that the Judge brought this out at the trial. And as far as courses, each student had the identical amount of credits. Blair's marks were just better. She did not need to take as many AP courses as Kenny. In fact, she dropped one in th beginning of her senior year because her workload was to heavy. Do you think she would have scored a 1570 on her college boards (and she didn't get extra time) if she were a dummy who got good marks because of home schooling? No, no, no.

As far as the $2.5. Again, do you really think that money was the issue or that she really wanted it? It was the only way to get the school's attention after months of negotiating.

Bookworm girls who win lots of awards and only participate in academic endeavors, especially one who is not seen in school regularly, are not the most popular with other students. Bet she didn't go to the Prom. Bet this would not have happened if she were the Prom queen or a cheerleader.

The thoughts of the above people are interesting. Many in the community feel similarly. The majority of people in the Moorestown area and the school know, believe and understand the truth. It is sad that some of the contributors to this column are giving opinions to hypothetical situations not the real case.

I think this column is a wonderful way to vent your thoughts, but clearly, don't crucify this young lady for untruths.

--posted by Another Moorestown Mom @ Wednesday, June 11 2003, 23:26 pm EDT

If it is in fact true that she was never even considered for valedictorian in the first place, my opinion of the matter changes (becomes more favorable). I haven't found anything to confirm this yet, though.

I also agree that some of the retaliation measures people took (e.g., egging the Hornstines' home) were appalling... reminded me of the ridiculous treatment the Dixie Chicks got for their one-line statement on their opinion about the president, which I really didn't think was such a big deal...

--posted by Felix @ Thursday, June 12 2003, 14:18 pm EDT

Felix and all:

Everything that I have read up to this point says that Kadri's proposed solution would have Blair sharing the valedictorian spot with Kenneth (and possibly a third student).

--posted by Adam @ Thursday, June 12 2003, 14:25 pm EDT

Judge Wolfson produced a letter at the hearing that Superintendent Kadri wrote to Kenny Mirkin advising him that he "was being considered for Valedictorian" of the class. The letter was dated within a few days or week before the hearing. Judge Wolfson asked the lawyer for the board of education as well as the Board President whether Kadri wrote any one else this letter. The answer was "I don't know." Kadri did not answer. No one else was able to produce one, including Blair Hornstine. Judge Wolfson concluded rightly that SHE WAS NEVER BEING CONSIDERED TO BE A CO-VALEDICTORIAN OR PART OF A THREE SOME OF VALEDICTORIANS, as the school board attorney claimed she was. Miss Hornstine would have NEVER sued if she was being considered. This is all the truth and can be found by reading the transcript or the 43 page written opinion. Mr. Kadri decided to take it upon himself after lots of pressure from the Mother of Kenny Mirkin to choose the valedictorian. He chose not to follow the rules and handbook of the school, a copy of which can be found on the Internet, which says that the student with the highest average at the beginning of the 7th semester is named the Valedictorian. Judge Wolfson told him that he could not change the rules in mid-stream and that the Senior class was bound by this handbook. If Kadri chose to change the rules on being a Valedictorian, he must prepare a new booklet for the incoming Freshman class.

Judge Wolfson also chastised Kadri for making public or somewhat public the marks of Blair prior to the beginning of the seventh semester. Therefore, the Judge said that Blair's civil rights were tampered with as her marks were not public information (even to Kenny's Mother).

All of the above is clearly public information and not my opinion or gossip and innuendoes from the Internet, newspaper columnists or troublemakers. Seek it out yourself if you want the truth.

AND THAT'S THE TRUTH...

--posted by From Judge Wolfson @ Thursday, June 12 2003, 19:29 pm EDT

Hey Adam, Blair was really never being considered for the Valedictorian despite what you read. That is why she sued. The school ignored her and her threats, so she sued for big money to get their attention and get her award. She earned it and boy, did she get their attention. She didn't want the money. If I were her, I would take it in a minute after all the egging, lies, and shit she has gone through.

--posted by Senior girl @ Thursday, June 12 2003, 19:37 pm EDT

Seems to me people need to calm down and look logically at what this case amounts to....NOTHING...or if you will something completely TRIVIAL. There are millions of people starving and dying around the world and people are payin more attention to some girl who wants into some university and wants some superficial title for herself alone....we need to get out of our own little bubbles people and see the bigger picture.

I agree with Adam. The parody is much more positive than what most are doing with this complex case, using it to avoid the real issues affecting the wider world and their own back yards.

thegeneral

--posted by thegeneral @ Thursday, June 12 2003, 19:39 pm EDT

Hey Adam, this I can help you with. This is directly from our Student Handbook.

Valedictorian and Salutatorian.
Senior students recognized as the valedictorian and salutatorian at Moorestown High School graduation will be selected based on the seventh semester weighted grade point average (WGPA). The senior student with the highest seventh semester WGPA will be named the valedictorian and the student with the second highest seventh semester WGPA will be named the salutatorian

--posted by me again. @ Thursday, June 12 2003, 19:47 pm EDT

Hey the general. Give it up. Are you the poster boy for social workers?

--posted by 4 star general @ Thursday, June 12 2003, 19:48 pm EDT

Mrs. Moorestown Mom, Leotyne, Judge Wolfson, Senior girl, me again, and 4 star general:

All of the comments from the "six" of you have come from the same IP Address: 152.163.252.162.

Misrepresenting yourself isn't exactly the best thing when you are trying to post facts about the case. Regardless of whether your facts are true or not, your actions cast doubt on their veracity.

-adam

--posted by Adam @ Thursday, June 12 2003, 19:48 pm EDT

Adam: Here is the info you wanted. If you can get through all this gobbligook, also please pay attention to Footnote 14.

http://lawlibrary.rutgers.edu/fed/html/ca03-1953-1.html

--posted by Judge Wolfson @ Thursday, June 12 2003, 20:11 pm EDT

Thank you for posting a link to the ruling. I am sure everyone will benefit from reading it.

--posted by Adam @ Thursday, June 12 2003, 20:45 pm EDT

Adam, your accusation is somewhat flawed. However, if you plow through the entire 43 pages, you will not question my veracity.

We are only honest, informed local people who hate seeing an undeserved hanging from the masses who would rather see a young successful person go down the tubes. For the Mothers and Fathers who criticize the loudest, I wonder if they are feeling insecure about not caring more about their children. (Hey, this kid earned maybe $50,000 to $100,000 in scholarships) However, the truth is the truth, and if you plow through it, you will see that I am 100% truthful.

Blair was forced into this situation by sticking up for herself, being true to herself and a far fetched story the Superintendent told about a meeting between himself, the father and the assistant superintendent.

As you will note in the paragraph, I am attaching, the Assistant Super backed the father's recollection of the meeting.

¶ 7. Kadri also alleges that he was told that plaintiff's father intended to manipulate the special education laws to ensure that his daughter became valedictorian. Id. at ¶¶ 8-9. (That is what Kenny's Mother said)
On September 19, 2002, Kadri met with plaintiff's father, Louis Hornstine. Kadri and Mr. Hornstine have very different recollections of this meeting. Compare Kadri Cert. at ¶¶ 10-24 with Louis Hornstine's Certification (“L. Hornstine Cert.”), Plaintiff's Reply at Exhibit H, ¶¶ 12- 24. Kadri portrays Mr. Hornstine as an overzealous parent bent on manipulating the system to ensure that his daughter does not suffer “the same embarrassment” he suffered when he was merely the salutatorian of his graduating class. Kadri Cert. at ¶ 14. Mr. Hornstine disputes most of Kadri's account of the meeting, stating, for example, that he was not salutatorian of his class, since his “class rank was never that high.” L. Hornstine Cert. at ¶ 19. Plaintiff offers the certification of Assistant Superintendent Judithann Keefe, who was also present at the meeting, in support of Mr. Hornstine's account. Certification of Judithann C. Keefe, Ed.D. (“Keefe Cert.”).

--posted by Mrs. MM @ Thursday, June 12 2003, 23:54 pm EDT

Here's a picture of the whiner.

--posted by Jeff Smith @ Friday, June 13 2003, 15:20 pm EDT

Sorry link didn't make it. I'll try again.

http://www.studentrewards.com/r-winners/discover.html

Check out her words of wisdom.

--posted by Jeff Smith @ Friday, June 13 2003, 15:46 pm EDT

152.163.252.162 has valid reverse DNS of cache-rh02.proxy.aol.com .. just pointing that out. I don't know that the four people referenced aren't the same person, but the way AOL handles its IPs for dialup users on the Web does obscure the issue. It's certainly possible for multiple dialup accounts to all issue HTTP requests coming from that IP, per my understanding of how they do things.

--posted by Perel @ Saturday, June 14 2003, 7:47 am EDT

Has anyone every considered the "math" behind GPAs?

A teacher turns a numerical grade into a letter (a 90 or a 99 becomes an A). That letter is turned into a single digit number (4). Yet, the GPA is presumed "accurate" to two decimal places (4.00).

The only "fair" way to determine a Valedictorian would be with numerical grades. Or, instead of "weighting" courses, give Honors and AP courses more "credit" and change the graduation requirements to a combination of "courses and credits" to allow for the difference in values. That would level the field for highly competitive students by giving more difficult courses greater importance.

--posted by Non-competitive, but still interested @ Saturday, June 14 2003, 11:00 am EDT

Q: How can you tell a Loser?
A: Find someone who wants to change the rules after the game's been played, because they didn't win under the original rules.

At a certain level, who gives a shit about who's Valedictorian? However, the basis for this whole "issue" is that it matters. And in that context, it is entirely appropriate for Blair to point out that -- playing by the rules -- she won. Period.

All those who either argue or, in the case of that absolute dillweed superintendent Kadri, decide that now the rules originally set up give some sort of "unfair advantage" to Blair, are just losers. You sheeplike dorks in Moorestown ought to accept the result and move on. Really. To those of us in other parts of the country, you look terrible. (And as for the Harvard students signing petitions, anyone want to guess what percentage of those manic overachievers ever failed to cite a source in a high school paper? I'll set the over/under at 40%, and take the over).

--posted by Jimi Hendrix @ Sunday, June 15 2003, 9:26 am EDT

Amen, Jimi

--posted by Mrs. MM @ Sunday, June 15 2003, 11:06 am EDT

I think that all of this discussion about GPA's and the academic advantage/disadvantage of private tutoring has missed the point.

The fact is that for better or worse her high school altered its program to suit her. The world from here on out will not be so accommodating. Her lack of grace over something as trivial as sharing high school accolades shows a lack of character that no GPA or SAT score will overcome.

This young woman perceived the recognition of another individuals excellence as somehow diminishing her own accomplishments. To go to such extreme lengths to avoid sharing the spotlight is indicative of her true disability. Greed, envy, and social ineptitude are not traits that develop over night. Nor are they traits that will serve her well later in her life.

Perhaps a year or two of junior college would do her some good. I would suggest one with remedial classes in teamwork, grace under pressure, resilience and generosity. Maybe then she will be ready for Harvard.

--posted by ThE Mann @ Sunday, June 15 2003, 11:29 am EDT

In response to Charlie Silvestri's comment about Hornstein not being to blame for plagarism in the Courier Post articles/essays she wrote and deflecting the blame to The Courier Post's editorial staff: When a writer submits ANYTHING to a newspaper for publication with the exception of letters to the editor it is his or her job to cite quotes, and references, that is a heavy responsibility given to someone by a publication. Hornstein's blatant disregard for the original thoughts creating the work she used for a high circulation publication was irresponsible and unethical. Also, her pathetic apology to the paper citing her young age as a scapegoat for her plagerism is unacceptable. As a journalist since my days at Moorestown High School this is not only a slap in the face to our highly regarded teaching staff but also a double taboo for someone who is to be regarded the best of the best (ie:valedictorian). But who knows maybe this Blair has more in common with the New York Times recently dismissed Jayson Blair than a name.

--posted by Moorestown Alum '97 @ Sunday, June 15 2003, 13:10 pm EDT

--posted by Air Force Cadet @ Sunday, June 15 2003, 14:22 pm EDT

Everyone:

I've updated my page with new information and commentary about the case, including the complete ruling from Judge Wolfson (thanks to my readers).

--posted by Adam @ Sunday, June 15 2003, 14:50 pm EDT

What a bunch of whiners! This girl beats your precious "valedictorian" so you write webpages bashing her. Not especially impressive...

--posted by Unimpressed @ Sunday, June 15 2003, 14:52 pm EDT

Unimpressed:

Read the web page again, and you'll see that this page is not about bashing, but about providing a fair perspective to the whole situation.

--posted by Adam @ Sunday, June 15 2003, 14:56 pm EDT

In defense of Harvard students, I know a great deal of them that happen to be honest, hardworking people. I've never cheated on a test in my life. Believe me or not, there are many people who couldn't live with themselves academically if they were cheaters.

You're more likely to be expelled from Harvard for cheating than for larceny, fraud, assault, rape, or murder. Those things require a year's leave of absence (unless you were convicted before you attended).

Scary, isn't it?

Sure, there are plenty of elitist overachievers there, but that's to be expected. Don't worry-- no matter how many of us dislike her, thee will be enough rich snobs who don't care and will befriend her if she goes there. The only person I feel sorry for is her bother Adam. Thank God he's graduated.

As a Harvard undergrad, my first reaction to this case was not outrage at the grades scandal, but at 1) her diagnosis of an immuno-deficiency syndrome and 2) the 2.7 mil in damages she's seeking. People seem to focus only on the legal standpoint and not the ethical/moral one, which, in my humble opinion is the one of far greater potential impact on her school, my college, and society.

Disability? We probably ALL have chronic fatigue back in good old Cambridge, MA. Welcome to the life of every over-stressed and underslept student on campus.

Yes, my friends, by the standard traits used to diagnose Chronic Fatigue Syndome patients, red flags would shoot up if I were screened for this "syndrome." Apparently, the main symptoms are:

Headache
Tender lymph nodes
Fatigue and weakness
Muscle and joint aches
Inability to concentrate

Causes? Easy. I have AT LEAST two of these. Probably
three. Oh, frabjous day!
(top three, not the giant yeast infection...ew. If someone knows what that is, please enlighten me. Is it similar to giant hives?)

Iron-poor blood (anemia)
Low blood sugar (hypoglycemia)
Environmental allergy (moderate to severe)
A body wide yeast infection (candidiasis)

The main reason I'm so angry at Blair is the way she's taken average problems and passed them off as unique. I get headaches every day of my life from severe rhinitis. The local hospital staff know me by first name. My school attendance rate was somewhere between 70 and 80 percent until the last two years of high school. Did they let me take medication for my allergies or extend the time on MY SAT's? Not a chance. And killer migraines are just as bad as having ADHD when you're factoring exponentials.

I won't go into the pathetic details of my continuously declining health and the car accident-related sleeping problems and the time I've had to take off from school. I *will* say that I've never used my illnesses or nerve damage in my limbs to ask for extended time on taking tests, or for a ranking as a disabled person. I lost points automatically in high school for being absent and had to do extra work just to keep my grades up. It's difficult to summarize how much health has devastated my grades except to say that I'm simply trying to graduate at this point.

Life isn't fair? Tough. I never received any help when I was down, and I still don't.

As for the money, she doesn't even need it! How can someone devastate a school district and still say they care for the public and the downtrodden?

My hope is that, while in college, she learns the meaning of "grin and bear it" all too well. I know I have.

--posted by Alexandra '04 @ Sunday, June 15 2003, 16:59 pm EDT

i think you seniors need to get a life, she earned it, she does not have to share what she has worked for, maybe he should have switched his class for something for more points, tell him to stop his whining, she out did him and thats final, i hope she went to graduation, she deserves nothing but respect!!!!!!!!

you go girl

--posted by liz correa @ Sunday, June 15 2003, 18:50 pm EDT

what an interesting page... from the perspective of fairness it does seem tilted away from ms. hornstine. i think this is a case of competition gone to extremes. the moorestown community and the students at harvard need to look inside themselves to see if they have any real heart or compassion for their fellow man. this is like another 100 cases each year where someone is angry that their child did not get valedictorian so "let's change the rules..." at the last moment. it happens all the time. and, everytime it happens it is wrong. i doubt the salutorian will have enough good form to go see ms. hornstine in person and tell her to come to the graduation. i doubt he'll have enough good form to be a leader and tell everyone to quiet down.

--posted by steve l. @ Sunday, June 15 2003, 19:44 pm EDT

Your screed missed the basic point: The school attempted to change the rules mid-stream: it was unfair; it did not survive the smell test. Or how about, School officials have limits on their power? How about, cry babies (those who want more than one Valedictorian) do not always win? There is always the one we like least: Nerds often win. School officials brought this disaster upon themselves because they thought their changing the rules mid-stream would not (could not?) be challenged. As the educational system moves into the fantasy world that there should be as few losers as possible, we dilute the Valedictorian process with multiple winners. In most school districts they announce the change before the participants participate in the game. Those who attack Ms. Hornstine, criticize her attorneys and object to the whole court process are just babies, crying because they lost, having trantrums and trashing her home. It is tough when you discover that in the real world there are winners and losers, and when one makes a poor decision (as the school did), it can cost. Ms. Hornstine is a better person for standing up to the school, her classmates and the community. Her win shows what jerks her opponents really are. Your piece attempts to put the blame on Ms. Hornstine on how the jerks reacted. Her distractors need to brace themselves. In the real world there are winners and losers. They better get used to it.

--posted by Ilbert Phillips @ Sunday, June 15 2003, 20:45 pm EDT

Pathetic. That is all I can say. This site, the Harvered petition, and the school board have all attempted to usurp Blair's RIGHTFULL position. *IF* the people opposed to her had *NOT* trashed her house, they MIGHT have been allowed an opposing point of view. Since they *did* send death threats and vandalism at her, they are patently losers. They lost and she won. That is how the world works. Furthermore, P.E. is MUCH less important then A.P. classes. This whole situtation has been skewed by the bully/football/cheerleading IDIOTS who populate our nations high schools. All such membors of the ignorincia had better be careful. For the rest of their lives, the inteligensia *will* be calling the shots, like it or not.

--posted by John Doe @ Sunday, June 15 2003, 22:37 pm EDT

This is too funny and appears to be an accurate set of events. From what i have read and heard in the news over the past 2 months, this webpage surmises it all. Ms. Horstine has to understand these 3 words because in the real world she's gonna get eaten alive, "Integrity", "Accountability" and "Humbleness". The percentage of people in America with a basic education borders maybe 40% and it gets worse as you proceed higher in the education system. The behavior she has displayed will be seen by many as trivial and nonsense. She has shown poor humility, terrible integrity regarding the issue of plagiarism, especially for that of a 1570, 4.689 gpa princess. For someone very smart, they either have no common sense or intentionally plagiarized and trying to find an excuse for their mistake. By junior high school one knows of plagiarism. Ms. Horstine has treaded shaky grounds and chose the path she is on. She has no one to blame but herself and overly ambitious-pretentious attitude. She will survive harvard, but get eaten alive in the real world. We simple-minded folk dont tolerate that type of haughtiness.

--posted by Nagesh @ Sunday, June 15 2003, 22:42 pm EDT

Blair may be valedictorian, but she is also a LAH-WHO-SIR!!!!!
It's rather sad that someone as intelluctually talented as Blair is not gracious enough (or refuses to be) to share the valedictorian honor with a fellow student, who seems to be equally as gifted as her. Perhaps it is the "win at all costs" attitude common to many in this country that has been instilled into her that causes her to be a poor sport. In her mind, and in the support that she receives from the "Blair camp," she feels totally justified in her actions and probably thinks that she is doing the grown up "big girl" thing by suing the very school district, and by extension, her own community, that she owes some of her success to. But, it's strikingly obvious that she doesn't get it at all. She should have to wait a couple years before going to Harvard. She needs to grow up and learn some humility and strike out on her own outside of the cocoon provided by rich mommy and daddy...because right now, she might be an intellectual giant, but she's as emotionally immature as a 4 year old little girl, when it comes to dealing with others in the real world.

--posted by Outraged in NY @ Sunday, June 15 2003, 22:46 pm EDT

What the hell is wrong with some of you people? You claim that this girl somehow has an ADVANTAGE by having this horribly debilitating disease? Seriously, folks! So what if she has to be tutored at home some of the time? The fact remains that she has the damn higher GPA than her classmates, and deserves to be the valedictorian. This would be a non-issue had she been present at school the entire time, so how could they not be discriminating against her becuase of her illness? Come on people! Let her get what she deserves: her place as valedictorian.

--posted by Dan @ Sunday, June 15 2003, 23:05 pm EDT

Be careful as to not slander or write libel against her. You may end up sued.

--posted by DD @ Sunday, June 15 2003, 23:05 pm EDT

Ya, and to make sure this doesn't happen, my posting shouldn't automatically be shown on the website without prior review by the webmaster.

--posted by DD @ Sunday, June 15 2003, 23:07 pm EDT

I applaud Miss Hornstine. I was not the valedictorian of my class but I do remember some American History. This country was created and continues to prosper and grow by individuals fighting for their rights. The proposal made by Superintendent Paul Kadri reminds me of seperate but equal conditions that existed in my lifetime (40 years). The seats on the rear of the bus were the same as those on the front but Rosa Parks fought for her rights and benefited many others. Yes, I believe that this discrimination is the same as racial discrimination. One feels better or more entitled than another based on something the other can not control and is irrelevant.
The idea of Miss Hornstine sharing the award with the second place student is almost as repulsive as the attempt to force her to do so. Judge Wolfson was correct in her opinion that she would be viewed as the disabled valedictorian. Would anyone favor a black and white valedictorian, a male and female valedictorian? I think not.
Bravo Miss Hornstine.

--posted by C B West @ Monday, June 16 2003, 1:18 am EDT

I came to your site hoping to read up further on the story and I found more than expected. The additional history and information helped me form my own opinion on the subject. Great job.

--posted by River @ Monday, June 16 2003, 3:51 am EDT

Super website. It would be hilarious if it wasn't so pathetically sad.

The main article and a few posts have hit it precisely on the head: come first year at uni, being valedictorian or salutatorian or person who streaks the stage won't mean SQUAT. And you can be certain that no one peers at three decimal places on the GPA.

For an apparently bright girl, Blair has done a really stupid thing.

As a Canadian (sharing this story with a dozen incredulous Europeans and Asians) let me say that what doesn't come through is a brave girl's valiant struggle to maintain truth and rightness, but rather a selfish and extremely (!) shortsighted group of people typifying the American disease of frivolous lawsuits and thoughtless rhetoric.

Amazing.

--posted by Stefan M. @ Monday, June 16 2003, 4:45 am EDT

Mrs. Moorestown Mom, Leotyne, Judge Wolfson, Senior girl, me again, and 4 star general:

All of the comments from the "six" of you have come from the same IP Address: 152.163.252.162.

Misrepresenting yourself isn't exactly the best thing when you are trying to post facts about the case. Regardless of whether your facts are true or not, your actions cast doubt on their veracity.

-adam

--posted by Adam @ Thursday, June 12 2003, 19:48 pm EDT

152.163.252.162 has valid reverse DNS of cache-rh02.proxy.aol.com .. just pointing that out. I don't know that the four people referenced aren't the same person, but the way AOL handles its IPs for dialup users on the Web does obscure the issue. It's certainly possible for multiple dialup accounts to all issue HTTP requests coming from that IP, per my understanding of how they do things.

--posted by Perel @ Saturday, June 14 2003, 7:47 am EDT

What are the chances that these 6 not 4 people from the same AOL server or whatever they hide behind are the same person? Very likely if you ask me. Or should we ask Blair?
_______________
Adam,

A thought about IPs.

Regarding the IP address, if the users are in the same grid on a cable or DSL system, and that grid is firewalled, the IP will be the same for each of them. Depending on the size of the grid, it is possible for as many as 300 people to have the same IP. It does not resolve to a single computer, rather it resolves to the IP provider's server, and node.
_______________

Regarding this scenario, first of all, while the public opinion is decidedly against Blair Hornstine, the facts of the matter clearly and definitively support her. She, in her acadamia, throughout the entire high school curriculum, demonstrated superior ability. Frankly, she did better than anyone else, and statisically, young Mr. Mirkin had a greater opportunity to acheive a higher weighted GPA in approved courses, with the benefit of having the school facility meet his needs directly, while Ms. Hornstine was unable to fully utilize the resources available to Mr. Mirkin.

Simply put, it seems to boil down to popularity. I'll address that in this fashion. I was not popular in school. I was the class misfit, outcast, what have you. I was never going to accomplish anything, and even had one teacher tell me I would die in prison. Wellllllllll, okay. Thanks teach, and by the way, I am the most successful person ever to emerge from my school system in terms of financial accomplishment. I started a little company that now employes persons in all 50 states and 7 countries. I have a beautiful wife, three homes, nice cars, and damned if I haven't been to prison yet. Sorry to disappoint you teach, but at the same time, I know for a fact that you have one of my products, I watched you browse my main store, and make your choice, and I know for a fact that you know I own the joint. You wrote your check payable to me, not my business. Haven't you ever wondered why it's not been cashed? You can keep your product, enjoy it, but framed on my office wall next to the page in my yearbook where you signed your name under the caption, "you'll fail at everything." is your check. It'll stay there, proof that you knew nothing about me, and less about life than I did, all those years ago when you turned your back on the social misfit that I was.

For those of you that question my veracity, if Adam wishes he can post my web address, (NOT MY EMAIL ADDRESS), and you can see for yourselves. I have recieved awards from congress, and the one I value the most, is the award from my alma mater as a distinguished alumni. I value it the most not because I finally got the recognition I deserved, but because it left no room for doubt, who the more determined student was. Which leads me back to Blair Hornstine, she EARNED her title of validictorian, and indirectly, the people, and paticularly the student body at Morristown has taken it away from her. We all know what hostility can be bred in schools, or have you forgotten Columbine, and the other horrors of student abuse and festering hatred, and the lessons all of us should have learned from them?

Bravo Blair Hornstine, and God Speed your journey!

Wow, I hope you won't consider that (the God speed thing, plagerizing John Glenn, wait, I mean mission control...)

She arranged good thoughts, big deal, she didn't do it for school, and the newspaper involved had no business releasing that information, without first, (and they did not) providing her with a copy of their so called, journalistic integrity standards. Wanna bet that same paper ran a story or two hundred about Pfc. Jessica Lynch, and didn't credit the souces, (un-named I presume?)

I've said enough, the point is clear, it isn't the letter or the spirit of the law, it's about what's right and wrong, and regardless of the law, what the school system tried to do to Ms. Hornstine was simply wrong.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Monday, June 16 2003, 5:26 am EDT

After reading the facts of this, including the little disclosed fact that she was NEVER even being considered for Valedictorian, I must commend Miss Hornstine. If this had happened to anyone out here, I will bet that each one would have done the exact same thing and sued. She outlasted, outsmarted and outwitted. Period. She has no reason to apologize, but the pathetic excuse of a school board certainly has reason to apologize to her.

It seems that the other kid in the spotlight concerning this entire situation was more popular than Miss Hornstine. Thus she is being very badly portrayed in the media, which, given the ethics of today's media is not surprising. How many of you out there, if your kid had the highest gpa and was not even asked to be valedictorian would take it standing still? The fact that this is making national news is also a joke and a testament to the ignorance of the public at large. We never try to investigate to get the facts. We only take gossip and whatever tidbits the media feeds us and run with it. My sympathies go to Miss Hornstine for the way she has been treated, both by the school board, fellow students and the general public. But this girl, with her 1570 SAT and generous amount of community service will certainly have a very bright future. The fact that she's achieved so much despite her disability attest to her tremendous determination and drive. Bravo! Hold your head up MIss Hornstine :) There are those of us out here how make a point to find out the whole truth, and we are in your corner.

--posted by Mom in NC @ Monday, June 16 2003, 8:54 am EDT

My question is did it matter so much she had to share the valedictorian that she needed to take it to court? Was sharing it going to really impact her life or college status at all? NO! But now it has impacted her life because she needed to be the one, as if it made any difference. She brought this upon herself.

--posted by JC @ Monday, June 16 2003, 10:05 am EDT

From Dave, a lawyer, and sole valedictorian of my own high school class some decades ago: Congratulations. At first, I thought your site was devoted to a fair, unbiased reporting of the Blair Hornstine situation (about which I knew nothing until this morning). It took several paragraphs for me to realize that your site is another of the apparently large number of smear campaigns that have sprouted and grown like fungus against her. Way to be underhanded, guys!

Who the @#*^ are you to complain about Blair, anyway? Why do so many people have so much to say against the life, intellect and, yes, perhaps dubious academic performance of a high school senior in wherever she's from? Maybe the outcry against her says a whole lot more about those who complain than about the object of the complaint?

Or maybe this is good news in disguise. Apparently, minor problems like war, crime, violence, environmental degradation, hunger, poverty and homelessness have all been taken care of, so that intelligent people like you can ignore them and pay so much attention to a NON-STORY! If you want to spend time on a blog, great, more power to ya. But stop wasting time on Blair Hornstine and pay attention to some real issues that might actually be your business - since Blair is so obviously not your business.

--posted by Dave from the east coast @ Monday, June 16 2003, 10:40 am EDT

This story has definately given me a laugh. Thanks MSN!! I'm a few years removed from high school and my memory of it is fading fast. Humbly allow me to share my opinions and make a few outside observations:

1. She could've taken the high road, kept her trap shut and shared the award.

2. Who is the punk that is whining that he should be valedictorian? You are both going to Harvard so shut up.

3. Noone remembers or cares about high school.

4. Lawyers are crooks. **corection** All lawyers are crooks.

5. All judges are crooks.

6. Blair, thanks for wasting the taxpayers money for lawyers fees. I'd bet you got your lawyers pro bono. They knew what kind of circus this would become.

7. Not only are lawyers crooks, they love attention.

8. Hey don't sweat the plagiarism. Lots of people do it. Even Martin Luther King did it. He even plagiarised the end of his "I Have A Dream" speech and tried to copyright it. What you did is nothing.
http://chem-gharbison.unl.edu/mlk/plagiarism.html

9. I applaud your attempt at Harvard and a career in law. (You know, with your Chronic Fatigue Syndrome it will surely be a "grueling" experience.)

10. Because of her "disability", what provisions are being made at Harvard to accomodate this disabled person that rightly deserves and will surely demand protection under the ADA.

11. I don't know what to watch now, the war in Iraq, the Peterson case or this piece of New Jersey sideshow, circus trash.

12. This sounds like an episode on Jerry Springer, Riki Lake or Jenni Jones.

13. Shoes begotten by devilish ways will burn the souls of those who wear them.

Thank You and Good Day.

--posted by The little people @ Monday, June 16 2003, 11:46 am EDT

that was it? Man, lamest trailer ever!!

--posted by snarky webcrawler @ Monday, June 16 2003, 12:09 pm EDT

I just hope Harvard has the common sense to ignore this "hate campaign petition" being circulated. I would like to sign a petition for Blair’s inclusion in next year’s class, but I don’t think Harvard should be looking at either with any credence.

It's obvious that Blair is an exceptionally gifted student that will probably outpace the efforts of 90% of Harvard's next incoming class.

Whether you feel she is a "whiny brat" or not, it comes down to the simple fact that she felt she was being wronged, sued, and had the legal system agree with her.

Personally I feel there is a huge difference between valedictorian and co-valedictorian. Although by the time she graduated from college or law school it won't matter, even to Blair.

--posted by John Kinnicutt @ Monday, June 16 2003, 12:22 pm EDT

I can't beleive the way you treat this poor woman. Does she really deserve to be treated this way? No! She has a disablity, which the school and its' board accomodated by letter her have extra help, she works hard for the under-priviledged, and despite her disability, managed to get the highest gpa. Isn't this the requirement to be named valectorian?

Asking Harvard to recind their offer of acceptance is wrong-in my opinion, I feel that you are acting out of spite, and the excess of websites and petitions show that you have nothing better to do but to torment this person.

To the person that wrote that her settlement would break the school boards budget..please look closer, since her settlement would only represent 5% of the total budget. To be honest, the school, the board and the students should be proud of the incredible accomplishments of this student despite having a disability.

--posted by Lisa @ Monday, June 16 2003, 12:25 pm EDT

Adam: Most of your readers seem to have read Judge Wolfson's findings, but a few either have not or don't understand (true, some just don't care), but I find it imperative that for those that didn't read the Judge's finding that I again post the following paragraph from her decision. Again, for those who call her unflattering names because she wouldn't share, SHE WAS NEVER OFFERED THE OPPORTUNITY TO SHARE.

"Board and Superintendent Kadri have made clear that they have no intention of allowing plaintiff to be the sole valedictorian, even though she has earned the highest weighted G.P.A. after seven semesters. Worse yet, the fact that Kadri informed K.M._and not plaintiff_that he was being considered for the award raises the possibility that the Board may not select plaintiff for the honor at all. Indeed, the proposed policy amendment is vague enough to allow the Board to avoid naming the student with the highest seventh semester weighted G.P.A. as one of the valedictorians. Perhaps with this possibility in mind, defense counsel at oral argument did not state on the record that the Board definitely would name plaintiff one of the valedictorians."

--posted by Mrs. MM @ Monday, June 16 2003, 12:32 pm EDT

Mrs. MM:

Everyone is making assumptions when arriving at their opinions. You make and believe the assumption that Blair would not even be sharing the valedictorian spot. I don't hold that assumption. With respect to your point, however, I have updated the page to include that possibility.

-adam

--posted by Adam @ Monday, June 16 2003, 13:24 pm EDT

IP Address Clarifiers:

Thank you. I now know more about how AOL handles its bank of IP Addresses.

--posted by Adam @ Monday, June 16 2003, 13:24 pm EDT

Judge Wolfson's opinion is the interpretation of the law as it applies to this case. We should all accept this and forget the gossip and rumors circulating in Moorestown and around the country. The law may be flawed but it is the law and the judge wrote and very clear, well reasoned opinion. This opinion should be read very carefully. Regardless of what the footnotes say, the body makes it clear what Ms. Hornstine requested. She did not ask the Court to enjoin the Board from naming someone other than she as valedictorian. She enjoined them from naming co-valedictorians. That there are numerous ways to regard all the information is what perhaps makes this case interesting. But there is much we will never understand or know about this situation. The degree to which the parties (Blair Hornstine, her parents, Ken Mirken, his mother, the School Board, Kadri, Moorestown students and residents)have been vilified is surprising and troubling. But every one of them has done something distasteful- changing the rules midstream, whining, vandalizing property, suing your school for a fortune, plagiarizing when you had to know what this concept means. At the same time, each one has done some decent/admirable things as well - achieving outstanding grades, trying to please all these demanding parents, trying to do what you thought was the fair thing. I for one want to stop thinking about this case and move on. It does seem to me that the adults have behaved badly and that the young people have suffered deeply. I can sense the pressure these academic stars must have felt for far too many years.I wish them well and encouarge them to find their own way in life without the well-intentioned interference of their parents. Everyone should apologize to everyone else and everyone should try to forgive and close this chapter.

--posted by DM @ Monday, June 16 2003, 14:19 pm EDT

Adam: Blair was not given the opportunity to share the Valedictorianship. With months of negotiations between the parties, the offer to share be "a" ,"co",
"only" "part of", etc. was never offered to her. As a brazen last ditch effort, on May 6, several days before the hearing, Kadri (where did he get the guts?)wrote a letter to Kenneth Mirkin telling Kenneth that he was being considered for that honor. NOT ANY OTHER STUDENT RECEIVED THIS LETTER. That, too, proved to Judge Wolfson of his intent. There would never have been a court case, if Blair were being considered to be "a" , "co", "one of" etc. KADRI DID NOT WANT BLAIR HORNSTINE TO HAVE THAT HONOR. I personally think it got to be a grudge match that he desperately wanted to win to show his power despite the costs to himself, the school, school board or Blair.

As to DM: The only way this case could have been argued and filed legally was "from retroactively applying to her a proposed policy amendment ..." (in other words, naming more than one Valedictorian)Otherwise, it would not have been within the legal limits of filing a lawsuit that was not "frivolous?
The legal team and Blair were more than happy and willing to settle for any decision that would have made Blair "a", "one of", etc. As I wrote above, Kadri wanted her to have no part.

Further to Adam: I am not familiar with IP or whatever. (sorry, ain't a computer geek) But with the info that has been given to you above, you can now believe that I am only one person and am not Blair or her representative.

--posted by Mrs. MM @ Monday, June 16 2003, 16:16 pm EDT

Blair is reaping the whirlwind now, and it won't stop for many months. I agree with your point that she should have shared the award considering all that has siince transpired.

One could make a point that she is a martyr for the cause of disabled individuals, and that she is to be commended for adhering to principle rather than giving in to expediency. However, that was before her unmitigated plagarism was exposed.

Obviously, Blair was accustomed to impressing others with her prose. But after traveling to China, performing good works, maintaining a 4+ GPA, and posting a near perfect SAT, who has time to craft memorable phrases about unity, thinksgiving, and nuclear disarmament? Here's where expediency plainly whipped principle's butt.

I read the comparison of plagarised articles in Newsday with great disgust. This was not a case of setting off a quote but forgetting to attribute it -- Blair was simply trying to pass off someone elses twenty-dollar words as her own. Its like a Will Smith song. You think he's a genius until you catch Stevie Wonder performing the same tune on the "oldies" R&B station. The worst part of it is that although she acknowledged her error, she never apologised.

A lawyer? Yeah right. See how many clients want to hear excuses about "chronic fatigue." Think opposing counsel will cut her slack? Wonder if the judge will accept "I didn't know the law" as an excuse. She should try a less competitive vocation. I'm thinking the post office is hiring.

--posted by Rebunga @ Monday, June 16 2003, 18:11 pm EDT

Daddy's little girl is in trouble. I first read about this story in the current edition of Newsweek. This story epitomizes the extreme arrogance that is suburban America. When your father is rich and powerful, there's nothing that can't be had. In my opinion Blair doesn't deserve a damn thing.

--posted by Sean @ Tuesday, June 17 2003, 2:26 am EDT

Give me a break. I don't care WHAT problems the other person had.

The deal is, this person EARNED the spot. I'm sure all the work she put towards it wasn't simple. She earned her place as valedictorian and sure as hell shouldn't be required to share it.

--posted by Drew Clock @ Tuesday, June 17 2003, 2:37 am EDT

A question for Mrs. MM

--posted by DM @ Tuesday, June 17 2003, 11:58 am EDT

A question for Mrs. MM

Do you know who initiated the September 19, 2002 meeting and what was its purpose? Thanks

--posted by DM @ Tuesday, June 17 2003, 12:00 pm EDT

No, I can't tell you positively the reason. I do know that Mr. and Mrs. Hornstine are very active in the school and have been for years.Mr.Hornstine has been involved with the class advisor in coaching the Mock Trial amd Moot court teams. Mrs. Hornstine has been extremely active in the Home and School Council and has chaired or served on many important committees. I do believe that she is the one who organized (if not, she chaired) the Senior Graduation Project which keeps the busy graduating seniors busy the night of graduation so that they don't drink or get into trouble. She was involved in the school plays, fairs, etc. Therefore, it was not unusual to see either one of them in school on any day. (I certainly didn't mean to write a resume of the Hornstines. It was just a way of clarifying my answer.)

However, back to your question, whatever the reason for that meeting, it is clear that Kadri lied about statements that Hornstine supposedly said during that meeting. You will note that Keefe, the Assistant Superintendent, defended Hornstine and declared in her testimony that none of the statements that Kadri attributed to Hornstine were true. Again, I can only guess or surmise the reason for the meeting. If it was to take Blair out of the running for Valedictorian, it was never mentioned in testimony. If it was because of the complaint by Kenneth Mirkin's Mother, it was not mentioned in testimony. See Paragraph 5 under II of Judge Wolfson's opinion. However, within a few weeks of that meeting Blair's marks were definitely made "somewhat Public" in order to "review" them with others. Kadri also requested from the teachers further evaluations of Blair, and as one teacher noted who had more than one IEP student, Kadri did not request info on any other student. Was Kadri just PO ed at Hornstine for some reason? Possibly, I think. Kadri was the new man at the school and maybe, he was on a power play.

Sorry DM that I got carried away with your simple question. I just am trying to set the record straight.

--posted by Mrs. MM @ Tuesday, June 17 2003, 13:16 pm EDT

Thanks Mrs. MM.

--posted by DM @ Tuesday, June 17 2003, 14:20 pm EDT

Any Blair supporters want to tackle the question of exactly how someone with bona fide CFS does 1000+ hours of community service, travels to China, Disneyland, starts three organizations, etc.? I have a friend whose only "disability" is being in her 1st trimester who couldn't do this much--and the stories I've heard about "real" CFS cases paint a much grimmer picture of the disease. If you're not too tired to work 10-12 hours a day, how exactly are you "disabled" by CFS? It sounds exactly like the epidemic of "certified learning disabilities" that suddenly occurs in upscale school districts right before standardized testing time. Also, if she is being graded by tutors, not teachers, she is de facto being judged by separate, not equal, standards. Any word on how she scored on actual AP tests?

--posted by Skeptic @ Tuesday, June 17 2003, 17:07 pm EDT

I don't know why I seem to be the "go to" person or answer man on this subject, but since I have knowledge and can read the Judge's findings, I somehow seem to know all the answers, at least most of them.

To skeptic: The following is directly from the Judge's findings and/or transcript of the hearing.

"..., and none of those students earned straight A+ grades, like Plaintiff received during her junior year.” Id. at ¶ 10. He is referring to plaintiff's junior year accomplishment of earning an A+ in all ten of her classes."

As far as the other info in response to community service: China was, I believe in the summer. She was supposed to be there for a short specific time, but spent a week or so longer than necessary so she could rest before, during and after. Her roommates at Disney World have written that Blair was very tired at Disney, spent lots of time in her room and was a "vegetable" upon her return. The other organizations were not constant or consistent work. Her Brother did some of the work with her, she had volunteers to do some. Painting a house, for instance is not a daily chore. The prom gowns that she collected were from letters written to stores, etc. and collected from friends, family and neighbors who knew about the collection. When it came to distributing them, that lasted a couple hours over a few days. And where did you get the 1,000 hours? Was that over 4+ years?

--posted by Mrs. MM @ Tuesday, June 17 2003, 21:03 pm EDT

To Skeptic: She didn't take any actual AP tests. I wonder why?

--posted by Another MM @ Tuesday, June 17 2003, 22:40 pm EDT

Ok Mrs. MM, all defense of Blair evaporated when it was demonstrated that she had plagiarized in the newspaper columns. Sorry. It isn’t done by honorable people. We write our own words. We do not copy, cut and paste from someone else's work. I am sure that there are people who do cheat, but they have no place at Harvard, and they have no place demanding anything from the school system.

Secondly, all this argument about "clearly she has the higher grade point."' No, again it isn’t clear, when you have to figure out three decimal points this is not a "clear" difference; this is a minor difference. My High School had several Vals, because they refused to calc out past one decimal. And they didn’t allow students that didn’t take all their classes at the school to be considered at all.

So, there may be much that we don't know, but I saw the comparisons of the articles to the original sources, and I CAN make that judgement myself. The girl is NOT honorable.

--posted by edna @ Wednesday, June 18 2003, 3:05 am EDT

I cannot defend the articles in the newspaper. All I can do is send again the following letter to the editor. I WOULD like to believe that somehow the Editor and/or editing is part of or the entire problem, but I certainly won't sit here and tell you that is correct, because I do not know.

Valedictorian not to blame

Regarding the so-called fresh issue that cropped up about Blair Hornstine, the Moorestown High School valedictorian, your headline in the June 5 Chester County section ("Fresh issue is surrounding valedictorian in New Jersey") was inaccurate. It should have read "Non-issue surrounding valedictorian in New Jersey."

If I read the article correctly, the young lady wrote the stories and essays. She didn't edit them. If there is a cry going throughout the land about facts and accountability, why didn't Carl Lovern of the Courier-Post newspaper come out and say the paper was looking at the editorial staff for letting an unsubstantiated article reach publication - rather than seeming to blame a 17-year-old for such a mistake.

This whole situation is becoming increasingly childish and petty. Isn't this about school performance, not who doesn't like whom and who has some ax to grind?

Charlie Silvestri

Vineland, N.J.

And to the Another MM, who said she didn't take any ACTUAL AP tests. It is amazing at the mis-information, lies and innuendos that go around. SHE TOOK MANY AP TESTS. Where do you get such crazy stories? That is the problem with this town and the uninformed at school. You are one of the problems, passing along incorrect info just to hear yourself talk. Shame, shame on you. When I hear such garbage from people like you, then I sometimes wish that the $2.7 million is granted. You are one of the people who deserve this to happen to YOU. I am only sorry that it can't come out directly from YOUR pocket.

--posted by Mrs. MM @ Wednesday, June 18 2003, 9:55 am EDT

Dear Adam: It is unfortunate, but I feel as though I am taking over your blog. I certainly do not mean any disrepect to you by seeming to answer many of your contributors. Yes, I do feel that some are incorrect, but in this land of Free Speech, I do have to respect their opinions. However, when someone writes in like "Another MM" and clearly does not tell the truth, I want to ask "did she just crawl out from under a rock?" Is she really a Mother? Or maybe she doesn't spell it that way? It is troublmakers like her who have caused this town to be the laughing stock of the nation. It is people like her (if she is real) who Judge Wolfson spoke about when she said that this case "has polarized the graduating class and the community_most of whom are uniformed about the facts..." Most of the people who have written in have clear questions or opinions. That is what this country is about. Sorry that I am venting to you. I know that this is your blog. There have been some intelligent comments and questions posted here. There are other blogs where people just write in dirty or nasty words. This one seems to open the lines of communication. Again Adam, sorry, if I seem to have more comments on here than you. I just sometimes feel the need to set the story straight, when I can.

--posted by Mrs.MM (the original) @ Wednesday, June 18 2003, 10:29 am EDT

Sorry Mrs. MM---the Silvestri letter DOES not excuse plagiarism. Lack of editing doesn’t either. She didn’t write the words. She copied and pasted them from other peoples writing. She didn't attribute them. She was asked to write "her words" and she passed off the thoughts of other, more significant minds than her own. She took credit for the thought and the analysis. It is WRONG, and she doesn’t seem to get it, nor do you. All of her accomplishments are questionable when presented with evidence of such petty cheating. She didn't have to write those articles...she could have said No, I’m too busy to do this. Blair and only Blair made the decision to copy those words and submit them to the paper.

--posted by edna @ Wednesday, June 18 2003, 11:31 am EDT

I do get it, Edna. As I said above which I am not sure that you read "I cannot defend the articles in the newspaper. All I can do is send again the following letter to the editor." I WOULD like to believe that somehow the Editor and/or editing is part of or the entire problem, but I certainly won't sit here and tell you that is correct, because I do not know. I was just offering you another opinion. I am not completely familiar with the work of a newspaper editor so I cannot affirm the letter of Mr. Silvestri. I do know that because of the newspaper articles, all of her school work as well as her papers for scholarships, etc. were gone over with a fine tooth comb. This is the truth and has been previously publically reported. These other papers were found to be properly documented and attributed.
Edna, I do understand plagiarism. There is no doubt that I would like to blame it on someone else, i.e. an editor, but I find that I CANNOT DUE THAT HONESTLY, without positive facts that an editor or someone else had a responsibility to check the works.

--posted by Mrs. MM @ Wednesday, June 18 2003, 12:12 pm EDT

Bravo Edna! The only aspect of this saga that does not lend itself to varying interpretations, in my opinion, is the plagiarism. Blair Hornstine claimed as her own the exact words of other individuals and that is dishonest. It was wrong when Jayson Blair, Steven Ambrose, Doris Kearns Goodwin, and Joseph Biden did it and it is wrong now. Youth and inexperience are not convincing defenses under these circumstances.

--posted by DM @ Wednesday, June 18 2003, 12:19 pm EDT

When someone writes something, or says something, it is supposedly "their" intellectual, and in the case of writings, real property. That young Ms. Horstine failed to properly credit sources of information, or even 'twisted' the words around to make them seem her own, is not really in question. Is this plagiarism? Probably. Did she have the concept of plagiarism firmly embedded in her head, probably. Is she guilty of some horrible crime, most certainly not. The fixation on the issue of plagiarism is not the justification for the lawsuit she filed. The issue of plagiarism came out AFTER the lawsuit, which was filed to insure that her school work, ((Which was then scrutinized)) provided her with the reward for the superior performance that she deserved. The alleged plagiarism came out as a result of the lawsuit, not as a precusrsor to it, and should not be considered as a method of justification in this situation.

Why is simple, these 'articles' were not part of her school work, they played no part in her grades, her perfomance, or her success. These were contributed to a newspaper that admittedly did not advise her of it's "ethical" requirements, or expectations for documentation of her statements or opinions, if they included quotes, paraphrasing, or other attributable material. As these documents were read by an editor, and in fact approved by one, these allowances by the staff of the paper to let these unattributed remarks be published point to two things; poor editorial control at the paper, and apparently ignorant editors who did not recognize these remarks. Until, of course, it was able to 'review them' after publication, and thus apply a sort of journalistic spanking to Ms. Horstine.

I do not think that Ms. Horstine had malicious intent, nor was she trying to deceive people with her 'editorials'. She was making statements which she enhanced with others' words, to enhance and magnify the message she was trying to present. Does that make it okay? No, I don't think so, and she does bear a measure of responsibility in that, however, her editorializing in a newspaper does not have anything to do with her performance in her school board approved IDE program, her test scores, her performance in the overall, or her charitable nature.

Has she made a mistake? Without question. The mistake was obvious, but it has no merrit in an argument about deserving to be the Validictorian of her class. Clearly she had earned that right, and it is a right, and the only solution that is fair in this case is to give her the credit she is due, and after the fact, hold her responsible for any wrongdoing associated with her editorials. However, as we're holding her feet to the flame, bear this in mind, every time you use a cliche, or say "as my father always said" or any of a myriad of daily speech patterns, you are in essense, plagiarizing the originator of the comment.

It's one thing to do so for a grade or money, it's another to do it for the sake of an opinion, and that's what an editorial is, an opinion. Everybody has one, just like **sholes... Think about it.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Wednesday, June 18 2003, 12:41 pm EDT

Mrs. MM and all:

I am glad that many people are participating in this discussion. As you noted, there aren't many sites out there where both parties are able to discuss this issue intelligently.

So, keep on posting your thoughts and opinions!

-adam

--posted by Adam @ Wednesday, June 18 2003, 12:55 pm EDT

I am also a semi-recent graduate of MHS and have been following the story through the drips and drabs that my family sends me, as I no longer live in Moorestown. With that said, I was absolutely shocked to open this week's Newsweek to find a story about my sleepy little town...I can't believe it's come this far.

I have a few comments to make, as I am disappointed in all involved.

First, The superintendent should have made Blair aware that she was in contention for valedictorian. Moving forward, the school district should amend its policy on determining that status (rather than get caught up in the minutia, as is typical of Moorestownians). The bottom line is that she was discriminated against.

With that said, the way Blair went about rectifying the situation is disgraceful. This could have been handled much better, and that is where her parents should have guided her more, rather than support yet another frivilous law suit (I seem to remember one with her brother, Adam, as well), which only served to waste the time and money of the tax payers.

Second, and perhaps Mrs. MM can answer this as she seems to think she is the be-all-end-all source, I heard Blair never had an IEP, which would have been necessary if she had a truly serious condition that would require her to have the status that she did. Further, I also heard that Blair's tutors assigned her grades, not her official teachers, which should have been the case. How can she possibly be compared to her peers if her teachers aren't grading her assignments???

Third, this whole Harvard business...Harvard will probably not rescind her offer. Plenty of Harvard students, as well as students from other schools, have done much worse and not gotten kicked out. This petition is also a waste of time and energy. Blair is already going to be cruicified when she gets to Harvard. I say, let her gather her rope and ship her off to Boston. What she will find there, like at my alma mater, is that everyone in her class was at the top of their HS class - her status or lack thereof of valedictorian WILL NOT MATTER.

Fourth, the egging of the house - please. Like that's never happened in Moorestown before. I seem to remember more than a few times during my tenure there when the high school kids went a little nuts with eggs and paint for that matter. While it's a stupid and annoying thing to do, THEY'RE EGGS. People, get over it!

I digress. Let me get back to the issues at hand...with regard to Blair's plagiarism, which is extremely juicy gossip and completely unrelated to her case, Blair completely lost face. Having been one of the first interns at The Courier-Post, I can tell you that one of the first things I was taught was how they wanted me to attribute sources. Blair's excuse that she wasn't aware of this policy is absolutely pathetic. Further, I'm sure as an AP student, she had some sort of style manual at home, as I and many of my AP peers did (thanks to our fantastic staff at MHS) - she should have consulted her manual if there was a question regarding how to source something, if she truly did question that, which I'm making the assumption that she didn't. Shame on you, Blair.

On a side note, this goes out to the person who ranted and raved about popularity - Moorestown is one of those places where the popular kid can be at the top of his class too. In fact, as most Mo-town graduates are your typical overachievers, there's a good chance that many of the popular kids will be at the top of the class - they were in my class. I don't know what went on at your school, but I have to question your statement that you are the most financially successful graduate of your alma mater - did you go around and calculate the net worth of EVERYONE to come out of your school? I highly doubt it. You sound like a bitter and pathetic loser. And, it sounds like you are still missing the point of why no one likes you. Get a life.

--posted by Mo-town Alum '97 @ Wednesday, June 18 2003, 14:31 pm EDT

--posted by Mo-town Alum '97 @ Wednesday, June 18 2003, 14:53 pm EDT

Alum '97: Again, I refer you to the Judge's written decision. As I have said, I cannot speak authoritatively on the Plagiarism charges, I can bring you the answers you requested about the IEP and the way grades were determined according to the 43 page ruling by Judge Wolfson.

"Plaintiff has earned these achievements in spite of the undisputed fact that she suffers from a physical disability. Because of this disability, _ The Board developed an IEP for her, as required by the IDEA, 20 U.S.C. §§ 1400 - 1491. See Complaint at ¶ 3. As part of her IEP, the Board granted her permission to participate in a hybrid program that allows her to attend morning classes and receive the remainder of her instruction at home from Board staff members. Id. It is undisputed that plaintiff needed this accommodation because her health problems caused “substantial fatigue” which rendered her unable to “attend [and] participate through a full school day.” Certification of Paul J. Kadri "

"Before plaintiff was allowed to enroll in any home instruction course, the Board approved the curriculum of the course and the home instructor. See Plaintiff's IEP, Complaint at Exhibit A. Plaintiff's IEP specifically states that “standard grading practices will apply” and “grading in Home Instruction classes will be determined by the Home Instructor in conjunction with the regular class teachers.” Id.; L. Hornstine Cert. at ¶ 4. In fact, in one of plaintiff's home instruction courses, AP Calculus, she was required to take chapter tests graded by her home instructor as well as the same mid-term exam as her non-disabled classmates, graded by the in-school instructor. Connie Nothdurft's Certification (“Nothdurft Cert.”), Plaintiff's Reply at Exhibit C, ¶¶ 5-10. Plaintiff received an A+ on the in-school exam, and an A average on her home instructor's tests. Her home instructor stated in a certification that “[i]n retrospect, perhaps my grading is actually more rigorous than the school's own” grading. Id. at ¶ 10."

By the way, if you think egging and spray painting a home with obscenities is child's play, how would you feel if it were your home...how would you feel if someone who read your note here did that to you and/or your family? (it does take time and money to remove it) It just goes to show that the demeanor of the town is not a place I am proud to call home and the parents and students who do this are not bright enough to list Harvard in their resumes.

--posted by Mrs. MM @ Wednesday, June 18 2003, 15:47 pm EDT

--posted by Mrs. MM @ Wednesday, June 18 2003, 16:09 pm EDT

Mrs. MM, thank you for the clarification and for the timely response (all of your responses seem to be timely). I am glad to hear that she did have an IEP - I had been told that she had not. That shows me that the school was utilizing the proper procedures in this type of case, which is good to see.

With regard to the egging of the house (I am not aware of any spray painting of the home - if that's the case, that is a shame and the Hornstines can use the proper legal procedures against those who threw paint, if they know who they are, as the Hornstines are quite familiar with the letter of the law) - I never once said that I would be happy about it, but in the grand scheme of things, they are just eggs and they do wash off. I never participated in such an activity when I was in high school and don't condone such behavior. With that said, I feel that if that's one of the few things someone has to worry about, they're doing pretty well. Where I live, I see people who have many more problems than the Hornstines do on a daily basis. I doubt they'd be concerned if someone threw an egg or paint at their home.

I feel your comment regarding the intelligence of the vandals is unwarranted. I don't know who trashed the house, but to me, that shows bad judgment, not necessarily a lack of intelligence. It's completely irrelevant if those students are going to Harvard or not. So, I suggest that you refrain from making such comments, as there is quite a difference between intelligence and good judgment.

Further, if you are not happy with the demeanor of the town, I suggest you move. It is in your control to live where you like. I moved away from Moorestown and am much happier where I live now.

--posted by Mo-town Alum '97 @ Wednesday, June 18 2003, 16:30 pm EDT

It's obvious that the bitch doesn't deserve to be sole valivictorian. It's a shame that American courts have become so easy to manipulate as she did in this case. If Blair had any class she would drop the lawsuit and allow Kennedy to be co-valavictorian. I honestly don't think that she realizes that she had an advantage over everyone else, not a disadvantage. Does she think that at a workplace she will be allowed to go home and take a nap!! Does she feel that her boss will come to her house and help her with her work!!

--posted by Be Fair Man @ Wednesday, June 18 2003, 16:41 pm EDT

Blair Hornstine is the last person I would ask for advice on how to prepare for college. If a magazine like Seventeen uses her for such as purpose, that is showing an err in judgment on their part and doing a disservice to their readers.

So, you think manipulating the system is a good thing? If Blair continues to exhibit the bad judgment that she has shown thus far, she will lead a very lonely life (despite whether she is wealthy or not - who cares about money if you're all alone?). That doesn't sound funny to me.

--posted by Mo-town Alum '97 @ Wednesday, June 18 2003, 16:44 pm EDT

INTELLIGENCE DOES BREED GOOD JUDGMENT. As far as my moving..My income comes from the area, although I don't want to brag about it. And since you are no longer in the thick of things in Moorestown, perhaps you don't know how our sleepy little community has reacted to this case. In addition to eggs, obscene painted comments, paint balls, letters and calls threatening the family, there was even one senior who threatened her bodily harm (hopefully, joking) at a Senior class meeting. This is more than just egging, safety is involved. How would you like police outside your home and monitoring your calls 24/7?

It is too bad that the senior class won't have a normal graduation tomorrow. I do wonder if the students, more faculty and parents stopped gossiping, etc., maybe they could have called some kind of truce (although that, perhaps is not a correct word) and come together to see that a more normal graduation would take place with the true Valedictorian and Salutatorian in place. Unfortunately, kids are not only influenced by their peers but by parents, too. And unless Kadri gets his do and is fired,many faculty members must keep quiet.

Your criticizing of me is not what this posting is all about. I suggest you stick to the topic or get your own blog...."We hate Mrs. MM" You probably did in your earlier life!

--posted by Here I am again @ Wednesday, June 18 2003, 16:57 pm EDT

As a further thought....I bet in the end she will have the last laugh.... Maybe not Harvard, but book deals, millions from Moorestown, television appearances and how about a monthly column in "Seventeen" Magazine on how to prepare for college?????

Perhaps so, but that's the problem with the world. You can be an asshole, step all over others as you claw your way up to the top, and the while declaring, bald-faced, that you're not doing anything wrong, and you will be rewarded. Mrs. MM, that is a bug, not a feature.

What's interesting about the AP exams is that, if she even took the exams, noone is talking about what scores she received (everyone mentions her high score on the SATs, what about the AP exams?). Perhaps this is because her scores on the AP exams would belie the "A+" grades she "earned" in the class.

This sort of rank arrogance and willingness to game the system from high school students and their families in exchange for public acclaim is why I never liked New Jersey growing up and why I will never, ever move back there to raise my family.

--posted by Dean @ Wednesday, June 18 2003, 18:55 pm EDT

When she received her Discover Award... http://www.studentrewards.com/r-winners/discover.html

"My Motivation To Do What I Do: "My parents always told my brother and I it's important to give back to the community, and help others who are less fortunate than we are."

Too bad for her that she didn't plagiarize in order to use proper grammar when speaking in public. It's "ME"! Karma baby!

--posted by Happy4LA @ Wednesday, June 18 2003, 19:36 pm EDT

Mrs. MM (a.k.a. Here I am again and maybe Mrs. Hornstine or someone else close to the family???), you're right. I'm not in the thick of things anymore and I'm quite happy about that. Because of that, my sources of information are the media, my family and my neighbors. So, as you have read the court papers and if you're attending all of the meetings, you are better informed than I and I will concede on that.

However, I respectfully disagree that intelligence breeds good judgment. It CAN, but it does not always and there have been countless examples of that throughout history. But, that's a whole other topic that I don't want to get into because, as you remind me, this is about Blair. I still maintain that she exhibited bad judgment.

That is truly terrible that there have been threats. I do hope they were jokes in extremely poor taste as opposed to actual threats - in either case, it's a shame that the threats were made and all this shows is an extreme immaturity on the part of those individuals who felt it necessary to threaten violence.

It is also too bad that graduation won't occur with the entire class there. Though, I'm sure Blair is enjoying her vacation in Italy right now. I know I would be.

And, on a personal note, I never said I hated you - I actually have no feelings towards you one way or the other. Hate is a very strong emotion that should be reserved for extreme situations, which this is not. We were merely debating - I respect that you feel strongly about Blair Hornstine, but I think you're being a little oversensitive and perhaps a little overzealous with your postings here. Maybe you should take a break.

I'll leave you with a question as my last post on this blog - if you want students, faculty and parents to stop gossiping, why are you perpetuating the rumor mill by contribuing to something like this? This blog exists as a place for friendly debate and won't decide anything with regard to this case one way or the other. My day on this blog was fun, but I'm going to go back to my life and suggest you do the same rather than obsessively monitor this page.

--posted by Mo-town Alum '97 @ Wednesday, June 18 2003, 21:54 pm EDT

By the way, S. Douglas Smith, in addition to being bitter, you are also misinformed. Plagiary is, according to Webster's, "One who purloins another's expressions or ideas, and offers them as his own; a plagiarist." If someone writes, "as my father always says," which you used as your example (note: my attribution), that is not offering the idea as one's own - that is saying that one's father used to make the comment. THEREFORE, one is not plagiarizing because one has attributed the statement. If you're going to preach at us, make sure you understand the message.

--posted by Mo-town Alum '97 @ Wednesday, June 18 2003, 14:53 pm EDT

Typically, you took a single example, a tongue in cheek one I might add, and tried to determine my state of mind, my state of being, and my entire state of thought. How arrogant of you. What makes you think for one second that you have even the slightest clue as to what I think, know or feel. Bitter? Over what? Ms. Hornstine was denied what she earned, because simply put she could not attend her ceremony because of the hostility this whole fiasco created. I'm way past school age Alum, way past being bitter. I don't need to be bitter, I just know what I know, and what the school board tried to do, and indirectly succeeded in doing to Ms. Hornstine is a travesty.

As for plagiarism, let me put it like this, the point was valid, but like most over achievers you selectively went after the most obvious bait in the post. Congratulation Alum, you've lived up to the nitpicking best of your peers.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Wednesday, June 18 2003, 22:03 pm EDT

add an 's' to congratulation, wouldn't want anyone to think I can't spell :P

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Wednesday, June 18 2003, 22:05 pm EDT

typically? you must know me about as well as i know you! :o)

i don't disagree that technically speaking blair earned her status. in fact, i think i stated that i agreed that she experienced discrimination. the school board WAS wrong in what they did - i don't dispute that at all and if you had read my post, you would see that we agree on that (i think that's great!). however, i think the way she went about achieving her end was terrible. suing a public school district is not the answer for something like this. simply, that time and money can be put to better use.

well, s. douggie doug, as far as your pot shot goes (which, i believe lowers you to my non way past school age level - yikes!), i'm in the nitpicking industry. so, i guess it's a good thing that i have that skill. and, correcting your mistake (an egregious one at that - i don't know why you would say that was bait. were you trying to be antagonistic and fish - pun intended - for a correctional reply?) is not necessarily arrogant. i'd have to go with obnoxious yet correct on that one. but, thank you for acknowledging that my point was valid.

and, mrs. mm - i believe i have figured out who you are. and, if you are who i think you are, you were one of my favorite teachers at mhs and i learned quite a bit from you.

--posted by alum @ Wednesday, June 18 2003, 22:37 pm EDT

and, i apologize for falsely stating that that one reply was my last. i can't resist a fun debate. but, i promise, i will try to refrain from hereon out.

--posted by alum @ Wednesday, June 18 2003, 22:42 pm EDT

Alum '97: Italy? Where do such rumors start? Blair is not in Italy and has not been there in 2003.

Be Fair Man: The other student's name is not Kennedy. Get your facts, man.

Those two incorrect statements are part of the problem being caused in Moorestown. Falsehoods are being spread. This is a terrible disease that many are exposed to and spreading.

I have even read in a column from a newspaper or magazine that Moorestown is in Pennsylvania. Well, this one isn't.

Also, dear Alum, I have been accused of worse things, but I am not Blair, Mrs Hornstine, etc. Also, as the school would not budge on her getting a valedictory role, her only course was to sue. I think filing the suit for "big bucks" was the only way the school would sit up and take notice. I am glad you learned quite a bit, and my wish for you is to continue doing so including this situation.

--posted by Mrs. MM @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 0:05 am EDT

I was going to say something absolutely above reproach but I decided that no matter what I say, in the obvious self serving arrogance of your own legendary intellect, you'd find some way to twist my words again. You do that very well, but it doesn't make your supposed diagnosis of my condition any more valid. What is obvious, Alum, is that it isn't a debate for you, it's the fight. I hope you win, in your own mind at least, me, I have better things to do, like oh I dunno, wash the car, in a flood or something.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 0:37 am EDT

So was it possible for Kenneth to get a GPA as high as she possibly could, as shown in the table?

--posted by Chris @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 3:38 am EDT

And she got their attention and won the lawsuit. So why continue to try to get the "big bucks" now? Someone stated the parties in negotiating a settlement. Why not drop the matter? They were vindicated and have a very strong judicial opinion to protect the disabled in the Third Circuit in the future. Why isn't this enough?

--posted by DM @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 8:35 am EDT

Chris, not only was it possible, it was actually possible for him to have a higher GPA than her. Because of the courses she took, the court documents show that statisically, he could have achieved a .25% higher GPA if he had performed his work at the highest level.

If anything, it shows that the playing field was weighted towards him.

A lot has been said about the plagiarism thing, and to make sure that we're clear on this, I do not support plagiarism, or people that do it in a malicious fashion. I am not going to defend her choices in that matter, but when it came out, the school system used it to try and implicate her in such activities for her school work. What they found was that she did not do so, thus mitigating the weight of the action. Does that make it allright, of course it does not, however, because it was not school work it can not be used to deny or deprive her of the honor that she earned with her school work.

What can be said is that Blair Hornstine made a pretty significant mistake when it comes to writing for a newspaper, but she is not soley responsible for it. The editors of the paper had a responsibility to see to it that she was in compliance with their standards, and they did not. After the fact they then used their oversights to attack her, and discredit her. Blair certainly was wrong to take others words and use them as her own, and not credit them, but the editors of the newspaper, obviously aware of these actions, took no action, until it became obvious that doing so would stir up yet more controversy, and create an environment of hostility that for them had a bottom line, and that was to sell yet more newspapers. Their actions are just as reproachful, if not more so than Blairs, because they did know, and did nothing.

It's like watching a mugging and not at least calling 911. Either way the editors of the paper have at least a measure of responsibility in this, and they certainly have a measure of responsibility to advise their readers that they allowed the articles to be published, either without editorial oversight, or because they wanted to create a bigger controversy than the lawsuit already had.

Regading the lawsuit, simply put, if she had not acted I have no doubt that the school system would have denied her the honor she had earned based on her IEP, which was administered by the very board which sought to discredit her. The only real question is whether or not it's worth 2.7 million dollars. There was discrimination afoot, and the ruling clearly shows it. Even if it's an action beyond the merit of the litigation, the fact of the matter is that the laws of this country supposedly offer equal protection under the law to all citizens. While Blair was without question being set up to deny her the honor she earned, it seems that many on this blog would also deny her the basic right to dignity and rightful entitlement, because she is who she is, and is percieved as a whinny brat. Whinny brats have the exact same rights as the rest of us do, and no matter what we think of her personally, it does not releive us of the burden of equal protection under the constitution.

If we are to suspend the Constitution over this situation, who is to say that tomorrow we wont suspend it over something one of you have done?

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 9:16 am EDT

Chris: Again, I quote Judge Wolfson:

" Moreover, a comparison of plaintiff's transcript with that of K.M. reveals that he had a mathematical advantage over plaintiff. Statistically, he took more weighted courses than plaintiff. In the four years at Moorestown High School, plaintiff took 8 AP courses whereas K.M. took 10, and plaintiff took 15 Honors courses while K.M. took 12. AP courses are weighted more heavily than Honors courses. An AP class is worth one grade point more than a standard class, and an Honors class is worth one-half grade point more than a standard class. For example, an A+ in standard Latin is a 4.3; an A+ in Honors Latin is a 4.8, and an A+ in AP Latin is a 5.3. Since K.M. completed 2 more AP courses than plaintiff, and she completed only 3 more Honors classes than he, compared to him, plaintiff was at a weighted course disadvantage."

And to DM: I am not 100% sure, but I DO believe that this part was supposed to be dropped and could have been dropped, but with all the negativity that has been around M'town and "forcing" Blair to miss graduation because of fears for "her safety", the threats, the lies, the property damage, etc.,I would go for it, if I were them. I do think that maybe the town and school need to understand what cruelty they have improperly invoked on a upstanding family and child. I am not sure what else would hit home for these citizens. Do you think they would all send flowers and apology notes?????

I do doubt that they will go for the $$ even though the Judge mentioned in her ruling the "polarizing" of the town because of lack of knowledge, and so on. I would also "guess" that based on Judge Wolfson's statement that she would make a financial award....but this is only MY opinion.

--posted by Mrs. MM @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 9:24 am EDT

To S. Douglas-Smith: I am sooooo glad that finally, some one gets it!

Also the "people" from the newspaper who were on the "discrediting team" were either friends and/or family of a "very important person" in this suit!!!!! I will say nothing further on this for obvious reasons. But as Lily Tomlin used to say....'AND THAT'S THE TRUTH.'

--posted by Mrs. MM @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 9:29 am EDT

The damages suit is in state not federal court. Judge Wolfson will not hear the damages suit. With all due respects to Mrs. MM, I think the "Truth" is not easily discernable in this case. I read Judge Wolfson's opinion very carefully and accept her interpretation of the law and her findings of fact though I encourage you to return to the parts where the Judge uses the word "may" regarding the selection of valedictorian.(Paragraph beginning "The Board and Superintendent Kadri have made clear....") Judge Wolfson scrutiniized Superintendent Kadri's intent and was satisfied that his actions violated federal law. That should be enough. I am not so convinced as you that Blair Hornstine would not have been a valedictorian and that the family needed to continue with the damages suit. Clearly, there has been much ugliness in this case. As I said earlier, I feel for the young people. I also think that the parents have pushed their children to succeed academically to a dangerous level. I live in this town and though I don't personally know the parties, I have observed them at school events. I fear for the emotional health of these young people. Unlike you, I don't find any noble parties here. This has been a Greek tragedy. The law has protected Blair Hornstine as it should and I wish her well. I also hope we can recover from this, learn from it, and heal. Mrs. MM and I may always differ but I respect her views. Like M'town Alum '97, I need to distance myself from this topic.

--posted by DM @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 10:02 am EDT

Blair made her point, got what she wanted however botched the execution, however valid her complaint. When I first heard about this I was amazed that a student that didn't attend the school with the class could even be valdictorian. I wondered how many students move in the last semester to go to a new school where they can rocket to val easily and snatch some fodder for their transcript. I always thought it was kinda wierd that the student that was deemed the biggest studier gave a speech to the rest of us on graduation.. its like.. you could have taken the time to talk to us in high school.. but you were too busy studying all the time.. and yea you learned alot and you are super smart.. but you're going to give us advice NOW? LOL

--posted by zenk @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 12:55 pm EDT

DM: With all due respect, the following paragraph from Judge Wolfson "suggests" that the Board would not confirm, even in oral arguments that Ms. H would be named one of the Valedictorians.
"Worse yet, the fact that Kadri informed K.M._and not plaintiff_that he was being considered for the award raises the possibility that the Board may not select plaintiff for the honor at all. Indeed, the proposed policy amendment is vague enough to allow the Board to avoid naming the student with the highest seventh semester weighted G.P.A. as one of the valedictorians. Perhaps with this possibility in mind, defense counsel at oral argument did not state on the record that the Board definitely would name plaintiff one of the valedictorians"

I do know, as you can surmise, from reading the case, that this "negotiation" to be one of the valedictorians or the valedictorian began in September. Ms. H would have accepted a co- or a or a "trois" valedictorian. She was not definitively offered any. Please do realize that this hearing was an emergency petition to issue a Temporary Restraining Order. This hearing never had anything to do with money. As far the damages, that was to be determined at a later date, if plantiff decided to continue with the suit. I will accept your statement that the damage case will be in State court, but I am not as positive as you seem to be. I believed that since the "charges" are against Federal Statues that Judge Wolfson would hear the damage phase.

As you have said there is so much ugliness in this case. Here is a bright young lady due to a "Witch Hunt" (don't bother arguing this point with me)that has been made more physically ill and possibly will not go to Harvard because of all of this. A young person who commits a crime,(please don't argue with me about murder, etc. I am not stupid) a misdemeanor, or
possibly something like a drug charge doesn't face the scrutiny this young person has faced. When this person has served the penalty, his/her life goes on.
In this case, if Ms. H cannot attend a school like Harvard, her future can be scared forever. There is a difference, I don't care what one says, that your opportunities for the future increase greatly by graduating from an Ivy.

No matter what, I do wish her well. I hope that she will continue to be the bright young lady that she is. I wish that her future will not be tarnished by this, that it becomes part of her learning process, and she becomes extremely successful and can laugh at Moorestown in the future.

--posted by Mrs.MM @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 13:17 pm EDT

I admit that I am very distant from the entire situation, but I take exception to some of the comments regarding Ms. Hornstine and the AP exams. Someone questioned why the media is quick to praise her for her exceptional score on the SAT (not SAT's, as many people like to write for some reason) but fails to mention her scores on AP exams. I would guess that this is because those scores have not been released yet. As far as I know, all AP exams take place at the end of the academic year, in mid to late May. As it is only now mid-June, I do not believe that score reports are due to arrive just yet. Also, if indeed Ms. Hornstine took 8 AP classes, as was mentioned above, I would wager that most of those occured during her senior year, and thus most of the exams were just taken. I myself took 9 AP exams when in high school, and seven of those came as a senior.

Further, even if she had not taken any exams, as was insinuated earlier (and later corrected), that would not negatively impact Ms. Hornstine's academic credentials in any way. There are a lot of reasons that students in AP courses, even the best ones, choose not to take the exams. I witnessed this first-hand during my experience. To list a few:
1) Honors students are obviously very concerned with GPA. Thus, many students decide to forgo the AP exams and simply take the course over in college to ensure a promising start with a few A's as a freshman.
2) Some of the top schools (like the ones Ms. Hornstine applied to) offer less AP credit than a typical school, thus making many exams, particularly those for single-semester equivalents, an unnecessary source of stress. Off the top of my head, I believe Caltech, MIT, and Stanford fit this description.
3) The availability of university-sponsored exams often provides a cheaper alternative to a $90 AP exam (less when subsidized) and can be taken at the student's convenience rather than in a flurry of examinations at the end of the year (including exams on material not covered in class since the fall).

Perhaps none of those actually applies to Ms. Hornstine, as it was mentioned that she did in fact take some AP exams. Regardless, one cannot verify many of the claims posted here, so it would be fruitless to jump to quick conclusions.

--posted by Duder @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 13:39 pm EDT

Duder:

====
2) Some of the top schools (like the ones Ms. Hornstine applied to) offer less AP credit than a typical school, thus making many exams, particularly those for single-semester equivalents, an unnecessary source of stress. Off the top of my head, I believe Caltech, MIT, and Stanford fit this description.
====

This is incorrect (or at least it was when I was there) at Stanford. Stanford gives you credit for AP classes, provided that you scored a 5 (sometimes 4) on the AP Exams. You can also be exempted from taking certain classes if you scored a 5 (one quarter of advanced Frosh English instead of two quarters, for example). A student coming in with high levels on 6-9 AP tests can earn enough credits to have a leg up on graduating earlier than someone who entered Stanford with no AP credits.

AP's are a good indicator of how well the student has grasped the material (as taught by the school or the home instructors), as the test is the same across the board.

-adam

--posted by Adam @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 13:49 pm EDT

This is regarding the pile of organizations Blair listed as starting.
If you look at the description, it says one or two of them are 8 years old and that she is cofounder. Helping found that would mean she was like 9-10-11 at the time. It is probably just riding with the brother's work, since if he just graduated (undergrad?) he's probably 4-5 years older than her..so I don't think she exterted herself unduely to do it.

But I was thinking... and tell me if I'm totally out of line here...
What kind of disability merits special treatment.. I mean.. Could she have survived high school and been tired.. just not have gotten A+'s in every class? Someone above kinda touched on this. Everyone has problems. At what point must accomodations be made? The just stunning academic performance out of class made me wonder. If that might have been the case...then in general, might a student have the right to do whatever it takes.. disability or not, to get the highest GPA? Like could a student argue that if he was home spending all his energy there with tutors he would make straight A's and so the school should sponsor it? I'd guess he couldn't make that argument because the school is not required legally to accomodate him unless he is disabled. I guess what I'm getting at is the extreme lopsidedness of the situation... like we're used to seeing accomodations made for people so they can just get by, and do the basics and fit in or whatever, but in this case the performance is extraordinary. Because chronic fatigue is such a new thing today, its like ADHD, alot of people don't understand it as a "real" impediment. Its such a general diagnosis and at this time its not a sympathetic handicap.

--posted by zenk @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 14:14 pm EDT

This has got to be the most pathetic thing I have seen. This girl took it this far because of people that created this page and people that are bashing her on this page. Who cares why she was tutored part time at home. Do you really think this is an advantage to getting good grades? NO! If she had cancer or some other deadly disease, would the public be more sympathetic? Probably. So, why she was home schooled shouldn't be any factor to this. Some students work their entire school life to be the best. She did it and was told she'd have to share that spotlight. If I was in her shoes, I'd probably have done the same. Now, someone that could care less about their grades wouldn't and those people are now her critics! Would it be fair to make a spinter share their first place finish with someone who was .5 seconds slower? NO! She ran the race, she won. She was forced to take it to the level she did. "Keep her trap shut and share the award" is what someone wrote. Is this what we're supposed to teach our kids? Don't stand up for yourself or what you believe in, just go with the flow?

You guys kill me!!!!

--posted by You guys kill me @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 15:24 pm EDT

Chronic Fatigue Syndrome is sometimes classified as an autoimmune disease that can affect virtually any system in the body. Think of it as a 'self-allergy' where the body attacks its own cells and tissues, causing inflammation, pain, and possible organ damage. Often it is difficult to diagnose as its symptoms are the same as Lupus and Multiple Sclerosis. Sometimes it takes years and years for one of the actual better know diseases to be diagnosed. Some other autoimmune diseases that you may be familiar with are Rheumatoid Arthritis, Scleroderma, Crohn's disease and Ulcerative colitis. Some of this diseases can be fatal.

So yes, things could get worse. Many autoimmune diseases need to be treated mildly with rest, vitamins, meds, etc. unless a specific organ or condition errupts or something flairs up. If you look up Lupus, which is very closely allied with CFS, you will see that it can affect your blood, skeletal system, skin, organs, etc.

Many, Many students are educated at home for short or long periods of time through their school systems. If, for instance, a student is out with chemo treatments and is sick on and off each day, he/she would qualify for IEP. A student who breaks a bone, if it restricted his/her movement and could not attend school, he/she would qualify. There are many more students than you probably realize that receive this type of education. In this case, Ms. H. could only attend school for a few hours a day. She needed to rest often during the day. If not, she had specific flairups, which could be very, very serious. (And do you think people like to discuss personal issues, like this?)

As far as organizations, she was an active participant with her brother in the MAGIC organization. The older she got, the more strenuous things she did. As a youngster, she was active in food and clothing drives. When she got older, she, not her brother, collected the prom gowns for distribution to those who could not afford them, etc.

--posted by For zenk @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 15:53 pm EDT

I am not saying its not real, or saying she didn't have it or anything of the sort. I'm simply saying its hard for people to sympathize with a disease that makes you tired.
I'm not saying she didn't help with her brother's organization, just that I think the title of "co-founder" at 9 or 10 is a bit much. Perhaps "participant" would be better eh. Not leadershippy enough of a phrase eh.

--posted by zenk @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 16:04 pm EDT

Do you think her brother put "co-founder" on his college app? Or do you think he just put "founder". Curious is all.

--posted by zenk @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 16:06 pm EDT

As a recent high school valedictorian, I understand GPA math well, but I haven't been able to get a clear sense of one basic question that in my view is central to this debate: If Kenneth Mirkin had not had to take P.E., would he have had a higher GPA? Judge Wolfson mentions that he took more AP classes, but she does not address the fact that this could have been more than offset by his having to take four unweighted courses that Blair skipped. Also, what was the nature of Kadri's "hypothetical curricula?" Could someone who knows the facts please let me know as many of the mathematical details behind this case as possible?

--posted by Interested in the math @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 16:10 pm EDT

Oops, my question was ambiguous. I meant, If Kenneth had not had to take P.E., would he have had a higher GPA *than Blair*?

--posted by Interested in the math @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 16:22 pm EDT

I was interested in the math as well and tried to do a hypothetical calculation. The court's opinion stated that Blair had a 4.689 GPA in 33 courses (33 x 4.689 = 157.74). If she received an A in three unweighted gym classes, I think her GPA would then be 4.632 (166.74/36).

--posted by Dave @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 16:24 pm EDT

Sorry. I meant 4.689 x 33 = 154.74

--posted by Dave @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 16:26 pm EDT

You know what? I'm going to completely lose it pretty soon. I think that 90 percent of the people on this page have a lot of gas to blow out of their mouths with nothing really to say. Instead of bashing each other and correcting each other's grammar, why don't you just step back, have an open mind, and think about the real issue at hand. For her critics, did it ever occur to you that this girl may actually have a debilitating illness that prohibits her from doing things that we all take for granted? No, I don't think so. Who the F are you to say what classes she should take compared to someone else. If the school board isn't happy with the ciriculum that one student has compared to another student, then why did they approve of it in the first place? The bottom line is that this girl was given a task and completed it to the best of her ability, which was better than any other student at her school, and for that she deserves to be the Valedictorian. I can see why she would be upset. You would too. I have been watching Mrs. MM fight a pack of wolves here and it makes me sick. Why is everyone so eager to jump on someone else and assume that someone who succeeded, did so by getting a break?
Thats all I've got.

--posted by matt @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 16:42 pm EDT

Matt, everyone isn't. I'm not, never have. I have said I won't defend plagiarism, but I would, have and do defend her basis for legal action, and her right to not have her efforts with her board approved IEP besmirched.

For those of you that think it's hard to be sympathetic to someone that has an illness that makes them tired, can you say narcolepsy?

Imagine your surprise if you suddenly fell asleep! Maybe while driving.

I had a cousin pass recently from an autoimmune desease called Schlero Derma. In almost 99% of the cases it takes years for the desease to be terminal, and by years I mean 30-40 or more. In his case, he developed the progressive version, and died in seven months.

I had never heard of Schlero Derma, and to be honest I don't know much about it, let alone if I spelled it right. It's called the disease that turns people to stone.

It's hard to be symathetic to that too, until you know someone with it. I'm 42 had never heard of it, and that's the point. What does symapthy have to do with it? She earned her position and had it taken from her just the same as if she'd had it stolen. All this debate is pointless, in that she prevailed and still lost. How sad, for the entire community.

And for the number crunchers. Mr. Mirkin had a statistically greater opportunity than did Ms. Hornstine of becoming the Valedictorian.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 16:58 pm EDT

Please read the transcript. The address is posted above. You will see that Kadri tried in several ways to "rig" the way he figured the GPA's.

Also, AGAIN, I REPEAT... Blair had to write a 12 page paper EVERY YEAR (4) in lieu of PE for which she was graded and received the same PE credit as everyone else.

Her GPA was properly figured, PE was added in. SHE WON! get over it!

--posted by For Interested inMath @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 17:33 pm EDT

Thank you for correcting my error. I did not see your earlier post stating that she recieved a grade for physical education. I thought the transcript said she was exempt from physical education. Again, thank you for correcting me on this point.

--posted by Dave @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 17:57 pm EDT

Thanks very much, Mrs. MM - I did see your earlier post about the 12 page paper but I did not realize you meant that in addition to fulfilling her PE requirement she also received an unweighted grade that was counted into her GPA. That fact, if true, changes my whole outlook on the case.

I searched this page but could not find any link to the transcript to which you refer. Could you please post that address again? (and is it a link to the real transcript or the hypothetical one?)

--posted by Interested in the math @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 18:35 pm EDT

http://lawlibrary.rutgers.edu/fed/html/ca03-1953-1.html

--posted by The Link to Judge's unedited DECISION @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 18:44 pm EDT

Since K.M. completed 2 more AP courses than plaintiff, and she completed only 3 more Honors classes than he, compared to him, plaintiff was at a weighted course disadvantage.
Furthermore, Kadri fails to mention the salient fact that, in reality, K.M., who was not afforded any of the accommodations given to plaintiff, nonetheless had a statistical advantage over her in terms of the weighted courses taken by both students

--posted by From Judge Wolfson @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 18:51 pm EDT

Mrs. MM: I thought you were posting a link to an academic transcript.

I had already read the section of the judge's decision pertaining to Kadri's hypothetical transcript and Mirkin's "mathematical advantage." I searched the judge's decision again. I did not find a copy of any transcript, real or hypothetical, in that document. Neither did I find any mention of a twelve-page paper.

I understand that having more weighted courses could have given Mirkin a mathematical advantage, but only if he did not also have to take more unweighted courses. Considering the judge's failure to fully address the physical education issue in her opinion, I am not certain that the judge entirely understood this fact. Because she did not mention how many *unweighted* courses each student took, the judge never completely justified her assertion that Mirkin had a "statistical advantage."

It is slightly counterintuitive for me to believe that a high school gave a student a year-long grade for a single 12-page paper, but I will accept this if you direct me more specifically to some real evidence. I apologize if this information is actually contained in the transcript and I merely missed it.

--posted by Interested in the math @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 20:00 pm EDT

Oops, I meant I apologize if this information is already in the *judge's decision* and I merely missed it.

--posted by Interested in the math @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 20:04 pm EDT

No, I guess that the Judge did not address the PE paper in her decision. I believe you will find it in the actual transcript which is not available to my knowledge on the net. She does mention it in one of her footnotes about keeping Kenneth's transcript private, and I would think that Blair received the same treatment in the decision.

I do not know if you noticed the following:
., plaintiff notes that she withdrew from two classes, with the school's permission and, in both cases, withdrawing actually lowered her G.P.A.. L. Hornstine Cert. at ¶ 2.

You will have to take my word about the PE info or find the actual transcript. It is true.

There is no doubt that no matter how the transcripts were figured, she had the better GPA. If she had been able to take the Bio or the government course she wanted, the GPA would possibly have been much higher.

This entire problem was caused by an uninformed parent who thought her child was being shortchanged and wanted him to be Valedictorian. But, as in in the decision..." plaintiff's in-school classmates receive benefits she cannot enjoy: plaintiff cannot participate in class discussions and share in the ideas of her classmates and teachers, she does not get the benefit of cooperative learning, and receives only half the teaching hours that regularly-schooled students enjoy."

So graduation is over, Blair was properly selected as valedictorian but because of safety concern could not attend graduation. Kenny was Salutatorian and was the highest GPA'd student to speak. And the community's disgusting reaction to this situation may cost them money and Blair's education at Harvard. I am so sad and ashamed of my neighbors.

--posted by Graduation is now over @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 23:12 pm EDT

Graduation is indeed over. Here's an article from the Philly Inquirer:

http://www.philly.com/mld/philly/news/6128159.htm

-adam

--posted by Adam @ Thursday, June 19 2003, 23:36 pm EDT

Trophy hunting....thats all this is. Since when did a title given by an institution make you who you are? Since when did it become apparent that suing for millions and that title would make you feel better? I think its more about the money than anything. When i graduated High School in 1997, I did not get the Regents diploma. That didnt bother me. Its only recognized in a handful of other states. However, when I ran into a few of the recipients of those diplomas a few years later, I saw how much "smarter" they were. Shiftless in their mind sets, they still only had the ability to blurt out bits of information from rote memory. I on the other hand had been "gifted" with the ability to think for myslef and evaluate things using my senses and not having to think back on BS taught by politicaly correct teachers. I would even consider myself smarter than the valedictorian. She had impressive grades yet was programmed. Good grades do not always equate high intelligence. A lot of people can be programmed with tons of information ready to be regurgitated on a moments notice, allowing them to do well on standardized tests. It takes someone with true intelligence to be able to deal with real world and real life situations. If Blaire Hornstine believes that she will be able to solve all of her problems with litigation she is sadly mistaken. Not only are there bigger sharks out there who will eat her alive, there are many people who will now remember this incident and refuse to take her seriously. I would suggest that next time, she uses a more levl headed approach. Instead of throwing a huff and suing, she SHOULD have shared the honor. After all, she did have a substitute for a class giving her an extra edge. WOuld she have gotten the same edge and or GPA had she had to have taken Gym? Possibly, but one will never know now. Since both got near perfect GPA's from BOTH sides of the spectrum, one not having gym and one having gym, they should have shared the award. If she still insisted to be crowned queen on her own then it should have been between herself, the school and the other valedictorian candidate. Possibly the schools from now on should have some sort of test or activity to serve as a tie breaker in such cases.

--posted by Ryan @ Friday, June 20 2003, 0:34 am EDT

Man, I graduated from high school 25 years ago and I could not tell you who our valedictiorian was or whatever became of them. IOW, ten years from now it won't mean a d@mn thing...except for the money, of course.

--posted by foo foo the snoo @ Friday, June 20 2003, 1:39 am EDT

Typical KIKESS...whines, cheats, sues...Wherez hook-nosed parasite Dershowitz?

--posted by Zyclon B @ Friday, June 20 2003, 10:42 am EDT

Zyclon, not only is that kind of attack uncalled for, it's baseless. She did not cheat. A review of her school work revealed that she did not fail to credit any sources, or quotes made in any paper she presented. Her writings to a newspaper outside of her school work can not be construed as cheating in any environment, because in order to cheat, you have to be graded on it, (there has to be a result). She was not graded for such things, thus, she did not cheat. She did excersise poor judgement, but that has nothing to do which her scholarly performance.

Her religious, or lack of religious presentation is not relevant to any conversation, because it does not have any basis as an argument for this situation. It isn't about what she ascribes to as faith, it's about right and wrong.

It isn't about suing for gain, it's about insuring that the rules that she performed under are adhered to. Suppose we changed the rules on you and made it a felony offence to use derogatory offensive language on a blog. Suppose because you did that today tomorrow we arrest you on the new rule and lock you up and throw away the key. Would you like that?

Finally, it isn't about you, or your opinion. Your statement is proof of your ignorance, and it only shows that regardless of what you learned in school you abandoned it for some misguided theological baseless reasoning that in your mind justifies calling someone a name without first addressing any real or supposed flaw in her character.

Typical, by definition means "like" or "simular, which implies that you feel all persons with Jewish sounding names are alike, or simular, or have certain value systems which are worthy of ridicule. Do you even know if she's Jewish? I don't. I wasn't aware it was part of the topic.

And, before you decide to go off on me, know this, I'm not, either, I'm Native American, born of the Wolf, my mother's clan, into the house of Leaders, my father's clan, and of the land. I do not ascribe to your values, or hers, or any of what I perceive as contradictory and puritanical religious systems that consider not the value of life, but the value of ones virtue over another. Europeans may have defeated my people in battle, but they have never defeated our hearts.

I am an American, and my privlege is by virtue of birth, not race. So is yours, and you would do well to remember that when you attack others.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Friday, June 20 2003, 12:08 pm EDT

Zycon B: YOU are the parasite. You are the lowest piece of humanity that one can find.

Your ignornant attack shows that YOU need lessons to conteract your bigotry. A Sensitivity course will still not make you a valectorian but it could make you H U M A N!

--posted by Ashamed of you @ Friday, June 20 2003, 12:43 pm EDT

Hey Hitler, find another website. You're wasting all of our time.

--posted by matt @ Friday, June 20 2003, 12:46 pm EDT

Adam, In the spirit of this discussion with many intelligent people, can't you excise Zycon B's thought because they are just malicious, bigoted and anti everything that is good about us and our country? No one, even in this country of free speech, should have to put up with this kind of venomous thinking.

--posted by Mrs. MM @ Friday, June 20 2003, 13:53 pm EDT

Mrs. MM,

I respectfully disagree about removing Zyclon s post. By letting it stand Adam can allow these intlligent people the opportunity to digress into an area where there is a clear boundry, and confer upon Zyclon his just desserts. I would think that we can all find ways to justify, and impact upon him the distaste with which we view his opinion.

Removing his post would be a form of censorship, and as soon as we do that, we devalue the worthwhile opinions of the other persons who have taken the time to share them. As cruel as it is, it should stay, if only as a way of giving the rest of us the opportunity to rip it to shreds, so to speak.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Friday, June 20 2003, 14:50 pm EDT

S. Douglas-Smith: I respectfully disagree with you about allowing this hate to be broadcast and fester among us. I find that you and I , whom I will call two fairly intelligent people, are wasting our time with notes about this bigot which gives him some form of acknowledgement and a platform to spew his hate. Unfortunately, we are not ignoring him. We all know that there is so much hate in the world. I find that by giving him the stage to allow others to respond to him, we are giving him some sort of credibility.

From today's newspaper: "Anti-Semitism is a scourge of Europe rooted in the same hate that led to the attacks of Sept. 11, 2001, former New York Mayor Rudolph Giuliani told an international gathering yesterday.

I would prefer that this idiot, Zyclon have his sickening comments removed. I don't feel that such talk is a form of censorship. TO ME, it should be viewed as criminal. (people, don't argue, I know it isn't rape or murder)

Obviously, it is not up to me. I will no longer discuss him, as much as I have things to say, as I will not continue giving him credence.

--posted by Mrs. MM @ Friday, June 20 2003, 17:16 pm EDT

Mrs. MM.,

I appreciate every comment you have made, the only thing I am saying is that by removing his comment we run the risk of being accused of censorship. I come from the most oppressed, and politically downtrodden group of people in this country. They do not require Christians or Jews, or Muslims to live on reservations. Now before someone says that I don't have to either, I would remind you that until 1937 all my people did, unless they were partially 'white'. That means, had married into a white family, and borne "pink children".

I know a thing or two of censorship, and of oppression. I think it's horrible, and I think what he said is criminal as well, but I think, fairly, that just because we think it, it does not justify removing his comment, because in doing so, we limit ourselves to not being able to respond appropriately, and in timely fashion, to his kind of ignorance, and if we ignore it, I assure you, it will rise up and bite us right on our collective tucasas.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Friday, June 20 2003, 20:24 pm EDT

Hi S. D-S. I understand all that you say. I, too understand very well and have had my share of Anti-Seminism. There is no doubt that I personally have not suffered as the American Indian has. I just feel that by answering that Idiot, we are recognizing him/her as a human being. I would rather not allow such a piece of trash to have any recognition. I also understand that you believe it is censorship. I just believe it is better to ignore the ignoramous and squash him (by removing his comments) than to let him go on (as we are doing) and allowing him to think he has some worth.

Please let's call this a draw. He is not worth the time and energy we are using to acknowledge him.

Let's find a new topic!!!

--posted by Mrs. MM @ Friday, June 20 2003, 23:03 pm EDT

Mrs. MM and S. DS:

I agree let's move on with the comments. I've had worse comments on my site in the past, some of which I've removed (it is my site, after all) and some of which I've let stay.

-adam

--posted by Adam @ Saturday, June 21 2003, 0:08 am EDT

I came into this discussion favoring one side of a black and white issue. I'm am leaving in the gray. Gray is not such a bad thing. Thank you all for your efforts.

--posted by Old Man @ Saturday, June 21 2003, 6:45 am EDT

Does this mean that when she goes to Harvard she'll have to stay at home to accomplish her work (or in an off campus apartment)? I wonder how Harvard profs will respond to that proposal? Then when she becomes employed,will her company allow her to perform her job at home? If she becomes a lawyer, judge or physician or anyother profession, she'll work out of her home?
That should be interesting. Good luck getting a job. What if she decides to raise a family? Will she have a surrogate mother, wife etc.? This disease is one big hoax!

--posted by L Walker @ Sunday, June 22 2003, 18:49 pm EDT

L. Walker, this disease is one big hoax...until it happens to you...

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Monday, June 23 2003, 0:08 am EDT

L Walker: If you would get some information on this condition before you open your big mouth, you wouldn't look like such an _ss. Pleae, before you make statements, know what you are talking about.

--posted by Mrs. MM @ Monday, June 23 2003, 9:46 am EDT

Since Blair's father is a Superior Court Judge, I am wondering what he was thinking when he started this skirmish last year. Was he thinking that he was superior above all the people in Moorestown? If that is the case, there is reason enough for him to slink away by submitting his resignation and moving the whole family to a nice warm place in Siberia.

I am sure that now with the commemcement over, he might be having second thoughts about all the damage he caused for his daughter and his family. He probably never dreamed that people would be so hateful and spiteful when the perception was out that he was trying to do something by using the legal system to push his daughter over the top.

Was it worth it for Blair to spend her senior year being publicily ostracized by a large majority of the student body, the town of Moorestown and the majority of people living in the Delaware Valley and also most of the people in the good ole USA. No matter how this can be explained by Blair and her father and all the lawyers the family can hire, once a public perception of unfairness and bulliness is made, it will harden with stone over time and no matter how good the explanation is made, it will never be enough.

Right now, the only thing Blair has for her is the money coming toward her in a nice out of cour settlement which will probably pay almost all of her Harvard tuition expenses. And then the real estate taxes will have to be raised to pay for Blair's lottery winnings at the court by plumbers, electricians, carpenters, housewives, mothers, soccer coaches, teachers, waitresses, retired people living on fixed incomes, people on disability or welfare who own a house, and assorted other people. I am sure that she will be very happy to see their wide smiles on their faces.

Pride is the worst sin of gluttony for someone from a family of overachievers. One can win many friends by a genuine display of humility.

In the final analysis, mediation would have been the best course of action for a pompous superior court judge to follow. No one is above the law and that applies to the Horstine family as well.

The best thing for Blair Horstine to do is to take a year off and do a serious course of self mediation. That would be the best way to find out more about her inner goals and how they relate to getting along with people. For one to grow up with such an arrogant and insolent attitude will only lead her to more problems in life and to end up living like Martha Stewart.

--posted by James Goodwin @ Monday, June 23 2003, 15:18 pm EDT

Martha Stewart has it bad? Even if her company died today, she'll still have millions. Even if she's convicted, she'll likely get a fine, $150,000.00 or so, which is about thrice the money gained $45,000.00 by selling her Imclone stock. Even if she never makes another show, or does another book, or sells out her overwhelming majority ownership to Omnimedia, Martha Stewart isn't living so bad.

As for all the sanctimonious rhetoric in your post, James, could you be more ignorant of the truth if you tried? Certainly no one is above the law, and by filing a suit to insure the rightful position of Blair at the head of her class, because SHE EARNED IT, Mr. Hornstine showed that regardless of the outcome, he was willing to place his faith in the law, and not a mediatory process that appeared from the outset, destined to deny his daughter the honor she had earned, on, what has been proven to be, a playing field slanted against her, inspite of the board approved IEP she labored under.

If the school system, and the people of Moorestown had wanted to do the right thing, they would have called for the ouster of the principle who created the problem in the first place by attempting to change the rules in the middle of the game. By not doing that, and by ignoring the efforts made by young Ms. Hornstine, the system, and even the community brought upon themselves, any costs, and any "smiling faced" pay more taxes looks, which of course, will be wrongfully pointed at Blair.

All she did was get the highest GPA, it was the system that tried to take that from her, and now the system has to pay. Oh woe is me. Maybe they'll think twice next time they decide to change the rules midstream.

So much golly, Blair's gonna cost us millions. To which I say, she'd have not cost you a cent if you had let her have the honor she earned, instead of trying to discriminate against her because oh, horror of horrors, she was patially home schooled. Makes me wonder what happened to the "home schooled kids don't do as well in life" crowd, doesn't it?

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Monday, June 23 2003, 18:22 pm EDT

Dear James: In your diatribe on Blair and her family, it seems evident that you are one of the blue collar workers you seek to defend. Remember, white collar workers will suffer monetarily also, just as there are white and blue collared disabled persons. You would be best served seeking a second job to pay for any increased taxes that might arrise from resolving the costs of this lawsuit. Any excess funds that remain after your participation could be spent wisely on sensitivity training for you and find out how it feels to have stones thrown at you.

You seem to be afflicted with "white bread mentality." Get a life, get a better job, learn the truth and GET LOST.

--posted by "MR." Moorestown Mom @ Monday, June 23 2003, 18:34 pm EDT

James Goodwin: It is fools like you who lack the truth and listen to the gossip who have caused much of this dissention in town.

If the truth comes out and hits you across the face, you will learn that negotiations took place from September until May. If you can't figure that out, that is almost EIGHT (8) months.

Blame Kadri, not Hornstine. Blame Mirkin, not Hornstine. Sorry about the possible tax increase. I do not like it either. Students, activities and teachers will suffer. That is the price for allowing a dictator like Kadri to run the school and make stupid and pressure decisions.

MR. Moorestown Mom knows a thing or two. He's correct. Take a sensitivity training course and then GET LOST.

--posted by Mrs. MM @ Monday, June 23 2003, 18:44 pm EDT

I am curious about the eight months of negotiations that took place. The term "negotiations" suggests there were back and forth offers and counter-offers. In one of MM's June 16 posts, it states that Blair would have been more than happy and willing to settle for any decision that would have made Blair "a" valedictorian or "one of" the valedictorians. Did Blair or Judge Hornstine make this offer as part of the negotiations?

--posted by Dave @ Monday, June 23 2003, 22:52 pm EDT

Waaaaaaaaay back up there ^, good ole' Moorestown Alum had a comment about my success or lack of it, and questioned if I had checked the backgrounds of everyone who had ever graduated from my school system. To be honest, no, I didn't. However, the alumni association DID. Not only was I the most successful, (finacially), I had exceeded the closest graduate to be by over 600% of their net worth. What does that mean. NOT ONE THING. However, as a method of verification, I would accept that the alumni association did look. However, what they honored was not my income, but rather my donations and establishments, including the only fully funded scholarship for students from my school system, and the only privately funded grant system within it. It also addressed the fact that over the years I have donated every computer system the school system uses, that I have provided them with buses, and a building, THAT IS NOT NAMED AFTER ME, but is rather called "The Cherokee Center for Advanced Learning".

One final note, and I do hope the Moorestown Alum is reading: although you came from what most folks would consider a privleged background, I did not. But I can tell you this, when I open my mouth and say something in my town, and in my area, and in my field, people pay attention.

I am not bitter, and as to your jibe about no one liking me, I learned long ago that you count your friends on one hand, and if you can fill that hand, you have done well. I have enough friends to fill both hands, and then some, but what is blatent to me is this, they love me no matter what, the rest, much like the alumni association that chose to publish their findings about my peers and I, cared only for the money they thought it would bring them. To this date, from me, it has still not brought in a penny. My efforts on behalf of my school system have been private, and will remain so. My donations have been made outside the alumni association, and will remain so, and for that I have a clear heart.

Now, as to the relevance of this, vs. Ms. Hornstine. It was noted that she was not the popular kid. As you noted in your missive, in your school system the popular kid was most likely the validictorian. In mine, the validictorian was most likely not someone anyone knew. At the time I graduated, my class had 397 seniors. The medium income for their families was less than $21,000.00 in 1977, (the year I graduated), and the average student had 3 siblings. I came from the poor side of the tracks, Moorestown Alum, but in my city, I am who I am because I didn't let self rightous people, like you, determine my true worth, and that is why today, I can sit in my happy world, and laugh when someone like you, who has no concept of the struggles of day to day life, would chide me for my accomplishments. And that is why today, I will donate another 400 computers to a school system that can not afford them.

I can.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Tuesday, June 24 2003, 8:08 am EDT

To those people who commented on my post. Here is a response:

Blue collar workers. Well, if I used the term doctors, lawyers, professional people who pay taxes, that is not the point. The point is that the misadventures of the legal system can wrought damage upon those who have to pay the property taxes. And blue collar workers comprise the majority of the area people live in.

Second thing, whether there were serious "negotiations" going on back and forth, there was a growing public "perception" that a spoiled, rich, insolent teenager was using Daddy's legal smarts to get it her way, instead of compromising on this to save the family's face. It is easy to blame the school principal and the superintendent for changing the rules in the middle of the game, but why did the Horstine legal team use the ADA to classify Blair as a disabled student whose rights were trampled by the school district?

No one likes to play a game in which the rules are changed in the middle of the game. If there had to be changes, that is something the school board would have adopted at a meeting in July before the new school year rolled by.

It is clear to me that the Horstines do not have the political smarts to see what their course of action is casuing them unnecessary pain and suffering as their reputation is being savagely pillaged in the court of public opinion. A saavy politician with Blair Horstine's problem would quickly see what the people were thinking and agree to the sharing of the valedictory with other outstanding students. after all, elicting your valedictory is a brief moment of glory for you as once it is over, everybody begins to forget about the graduation and begin planning for college and the rest of their lives.

I bear no bitterness toward Blair and wish her the best in all her endeavors, but I do wish that the whole thing was settled amicably in the first place. For people who support Blair Horstine to say that the Moorestown School District was vengeful and vindictive toward one of its students who happened to have a very high GPA would run in counter with its mission to encouraging students to strive to their best abilities.

This saga has opened the eyes of a lot of people as to the machinations of their school district. We have seen the suicide of the superitendent of the Chichester School District and the female solictor of the school district who was investigating the now dead superintendent of alleged improprieties terminated from her position. When a school district is running smoothly, few people will bother to attend their hearings, but when something like Blair's case or the Chichester School District's superintendent committing sucicide happens, then all take attention.

Jim

--posted by James Goodwin @ Tuesday, June 24 2003, 8:20 am EDT

James,

Fact: Blair's IEP was approved years before this became an issue.
Fact: Kadri attempted to devolve the process, which was approved by the FULL board, in order to have Mr. Mirkin, either outright recieve the Validitory award, or force Blair to share it with him.
Fact: Kenneth Mirkin, via the classes he took, could have gotten a higher GPA than Blair, with no changes to any percieved slight. He simply did not
Fact: Kadri attempted to skew the numbers, read the court findings on his hypothetical GPA analysis.
Fact: In oral aurguments, the attorney for the BOARD refused to mention the possibility of sharing the Valadictory, or even awarding it to Blair, mentioning only that Mr. Mirkin had recieved notice that he was being considered for it, and noting that Blair had not recieved such notice, thereby finding that the BOARD, through Mr. Kadri, was attempting to deprive Blair of her award.
Fact: Although the Hornstines were essentially willing to share the award, the BOARD wanted only one Valadictorian, until it became a legal matter, at which point, the Hornstines declined to share the award, as granted, because the BOARD had forced them to make the move into the court system
Fact: The Hornstines won on all points.
Fact: The board lost on all points.

Conclusion: Had the board simply backed off, and let the process go as it had established in the student handbook, and by the rules that Blair Hornstine worked to acheive her place in school history, this story would not have taken on the national significance that it has. Had the board, and Mr. Kadri, simply pointed out that Blair was studying under an IEP that they approved, and that it was actually possible for Mr. Mirkin to obtain a higher GPA, and that he had not, then this case wouldn't have gotten past the parent/board stage that eventually involved the community in what has now become a two sided issue, the Blair camp and the Anti Blair camp.

Blair Hornstine was stripped of her rightful award by the hostility and bitterness that the communities actions created by not following the rules established for the awarding of the valadictory when she started high school. She did not attend her graduation, and that can not be replaced. She was in fear, and rightfully so, as she had been threatened. Do we need to forget Columbine before we realize that such threats need to be taken seriously?

I too, wish that it had been settled amicably, but when the Hornstines tried to do so, the Board, and Mr. Kadri in particular, went on a crusade to discredit and destroy her. Mr. Kadri's actions in particular, and the boards in general are indeed discrimnatory, and as always, in the end, it is the average citizen that will bear the cost of it. The sad part is this, the average citizens could have and should have made their voices heard, for right over wrong. Now, when the battle is won, their bitching over the spoils of war.

Generally, throughout history, this is what the defeated have done, bitch over what they lost, and forget that they'd have never lost it in the first place if they hadn't stuck out their hand for a bigger piece of the pie.

Moorestown should have to pay, and it's citizens should be required to read every word of the judgement, and then required to teach their children the difference between selfish indulgence, and rightful entitlement. Blair was rightfully entitled, and the community selfishly indulged their popular choice for a frivolous award with the possibility that after the game was played, they, (the community), would change the rules in order to crown THEIR king.

To the victor goes the spoils, and to the vanquished go the boils, so let it be written, so let it be done.

Doesn't reality just suck?

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Tuesday, June 24 2003, 12:46 pm EDT

Jim and Dave: You do not get one thing: The Superintendent (or those who make the decisions) WERE NOT AND WOULD NOT CONSIDER BLAIR FOR THE VALEDICTORIAN,
in any shape or form, like "co," "a," "part of," etc.
The Superintendent TRIED to changes the rules in midstream, not in July for a new class entering MHS.It doesn't seem that you get it. Pleeeease read the Judge's decision.

As far as the ADA, Ms. Hornstine had been classified as a disabled student by her Freshman year. Would you still call a disabled student who was, for instance, a paraplegic, "a spoiled, rich, insolent teenager?" I don't think you are that pathetic. You just don't understand that a disability doesn't have to be a full motor type one.

Also, Jim, if you believe in your paragraph 3, then you wouldn't write paragraph 2 and 5. You speak out of both sides of your mouth, as "they" say. With the exception of paragraph 3, you are so out of touch. I am sure that if you were #1, you wouldn't let someone ignore you. If your favorite sports team lost by a point or was tied, you wouldn't accept the losing team gaining the win if, for instance, they were the home team or something as ridiculous.

Yes, I do suppose that you are correct that the Hornstines' do not have political savvy. They are not politicians, they are a family (like any other, blue collar, white collar, rich or poor) that want WHAT IS RIGHT. They have the right not to be pushed around by "powers" like the Superintendent who was trying to exert his authority. That is a dictatorship.

Jim: You seem to change your mind the further you go into your comments. You are right that people are sitting up and noticing their school systems. In the Moorestown case, you just put the blame on the incorrect person. Just as in some other school situations, it was not the student and/or the parents that caused the problems...it was the school administration.

You bear no bitterness towards Blair, you say. Then why blame her and her family for an unjust or untrue situations? I am sure that not only did the Hornstines expect or want the reactions that occurred but also wish they had not been FORCED into the legal arena. If the school was truly an encouraging one, they would not have trampled on the student who strived so hard despite her disability and not because of her disability (I am paraphrasing Judge Wolfson). This was not a "misadventure" of the legal system. It was a "misadventure" by the school and superintendent. They are to blame for the financial woes of the citizens of Moorestown. If the good citizens of Moorestown pay attention and become more involved in what "really" goes on, they will see to it that their Superintendent and possibly others in the administration and Board of Education GET THE BOOT. If they don't get involved, they deserve the punishments (tax increases) they get.

--posted by Mrs. MM @ Tuesday, June 24 2003, 13:28 pm EDT

Mrs. MM, I did read the court's opinion. I am aware that Ken Mirkin is the only one who received a "consideration" letter. The opinion stated that the letter was sent five days after the lawsuit was filed. It appears that the primary, if only, reason for the letter was to give Ken standing to participate in the lawsuit. My assumption is that the Mirkins were not content to sit on the sidelines and wanted to participate in the lawsuit.

I am also aware that the attorneys for the Board were unwilling to state that Blair would have been selected by the Board as one of the valedictorians. Your interpretation of this statement is that she was not going to be selected. Another possible interpretation is that the attorneys couldn't guarantee the results of a vote that had not yet occurred.

My question yesterday was an attempt to understand what happened during the eight months of negotiations you referred to. One of the things I didn't get was why the Hornstines didn't propose the shared valedictorian alternative if Blair would have been more than happy with that result (as you previously indicated). If I understand your response correctly, it is because they didn't believe the proposal would be accepted by the Board.

She had the right to sue. She did and she won the right to be sole valedictorian. I recognize that. I was trying to understand why the parties couldn't work something out short of a lawsuit given that Blair would have been more than happy to be one of the valedictorians. Your responses suggest that the Superintendent and the School Board had such a vendetta against the Hornstines that this was not possible.

--posted by Dave @ Tuesday, June 24 2003, 16:36 pm EDT

Mrs. MM (I mean Mr. or Mrs. or Miss Hornstine),

The more you defend Blair with legal verbiage, the more the "other side" wins. Perception has become reality and Blair will never change opinion. She has LOST in the court of public opinion. Deal with it. Even if Blair was "right" according to the courts, her actions were petty and selfish. It does not matter if the Mirkins or the Superintendent were wrong in the beginning...Blair decided to go to court and therefore made this public. Oh, and how do you defend the fact that she cheats (plagiarism)? The best hope for her is to let this die down in a few years.

Two pointers for Blair: (1)Choose another school besides Harvard. We really do not want you here. Your life will be miserable if you come. (2) I suggest if you get married that you move away from the East Coast and take your husband's last name. Maybe someday you can escape your shame.

--posted by Harvard '04 @ Tuesday, June 24 2003, 17:03 pm EDT

Thank you for the compliment. The entire Hornstine family is bright and articulate. I take it as a compliment that you think I am one of them. False, false, false.

As I read S. Douglass-Smith's comments, I notice that "he gets it" too. He does in prior writings state that he is a member of the Cherokee Indians, a proud heritage. I suppose that there were no Jewish Cherokee Indians or you would have accused him of being a family member also.

Lastly, I cannot believe you are a member of the class of 2004 at Harvard unless you are a relative of a member of the MHS School Board, a Mirkin relative or a Kadri relative. The theories that you espouse are not the thoughts of educated student plus your writing is primitive. If this is the education that you supposedly are getting at Harvard, and you will attempt to join others to make Blair's life miserable because she lost in the court of public opinion, I truly hope that she attends Yale. Most Harvard students have better things to do then make a Freshman miserable. Real Harvard students spend their non-studying time on good causes. Ask S. Douglass-Smith,
maybe you can work on some real issues like helping the American Indians.

--posted by Mrs. MM @ Tuesday, June 24 2003, 17:40 pm EDT

Hey Harvard '04...Does your family tree go back as far to the ones that stole the Indians' land from them?

Do you remember the commercial where there was a tear in an Indian's eye because he saw trash floating in a stream? Were you on that stream rafting that day?

Now that Blair has been ostricized and humiliated beyond belief by you, I say the following: IF YOU WHIP'EM, YOU GET THE WHAMPUM. Therefore, in plain English....she is entitled to the money. (an explanation for Harvard, in case of lack of understanding.)

Sorry if this was not proper or politically correct, S. Douglass-Smith; this was not meant to be of any disrespect to you and/or your people.

--posted by "MR." Moorestown Mom @ Tuesday, June 24 2003, 17:54 pm EDT

I know my family history back beyond the time of the whites in this land. I know my heritage to a time when only the buffalo and the deer were thought to outnumber the sand upon the beaches. I know my history from before it was written by white men, and soiled by the petty differences of people who did not understand the rising of the sun, or the setting of the moon.

I am beyond what these people have done to the land, and to the places that we call sacred. I am beyond what is or is not legal in the society that now we all share. I am beyond what would be, and the 10,000 broken treaties, and I am beyond what will be, and treaties that need not be inked.

I do not, nor would my people, I believe, need the help of one such as that, Harvard, who's school sits upon land one known to my people as a sacred place. The memory of my heritage is long, and full of losses, we would not care to lose more to one who has less knowledge of self, than even a stone in the streams.

Invite him to help Ms. Hornstine learn to manage her money, or to pass it on to those less fortunate than herself, but my people and I, we shall endeavor alone what the white man has always failed to honor, and that is integrity, and honesty, and trust of ourselves within the land of our fathers, upon the civilization of yours.

My point, though flowery? Simple enough. Your society, our society, bears many scars. This is but another one of those scars. What tears the people is that they are jealous, and afraid. Jealous of what she is to become, and afraid of what she is already. It is not often that one so clearly comes forward with a tale that is beyond reproach.

She did not cheat. She could garner no award for her writings in the papers, thus she could not cheat. She made errors of omission, and perhaps she simply chose to steal the words of others, but it is no matter, because she did not cheat, the articles meant nothing, and held no place in her school work, which has been proven to be pure. She may have misled but her guilt is shared by those greater powers that did nothing to correct her, and even less to protect her from their own wildly spinning daggars when they chose to expose her writings for what they were.

She did not cheat, she did not take from others what was not hers to take in school. She deprived no one of their rightful gain, and for this horrible crime of intelligence, she is to be ostricized? And then you wonder why we, (my people) would reject your help? You can't even help yourselves without first destroying all that is good about you.

When will we ever learn?

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Tuesday, June 24 2003, 18:28 pm EDT

Amen!

--posted by Mrs.MM @ Tuesday, June 24 2003, 22:09 pm EDT

What. The. Crap.

--posted by Zuh? @ Wednesday, June 25 2003, 3:57 am EDT

Wow. That was intelligent!

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Wednesday, June 25 2003, 8:21 am EDT

Dear Mrs. MM,

I was stating my opinion; I apologize if I offended you. Thanks for attacking my intelligence and my writing skills. I am sorry that you cannot believe a “down-to-earth” person like me can possibly attend Harvard.

I earned my way to Harvard by working hard, achieving high grades, and by earning high test scores. My family is not rich or connected; I came from a much more humble background than Blair did. My father was a schoolteacher and my mother was a homemaker. I was not fortunate to attend a great high school like Moorestown. I believe I am only the second person in the history of my high school to attend Harvard. Criticize me all you want; my family and my community are proud of me.

“Real Harvard students spend their non-studying time on good causes.” Sorry, I hate to admit it, but most Harvard students participate in good causes before they apply to Harvard so they will look good on paper (like Blair). Most Harvard students are too competitive to participate in good deeds while attending school. There are also a few students like me who are too poor to volunteer for good causes while at Harvard. I am too busy working during some evenings and the weekends so I can afford living in the Harvard atmosphere. Although I received scholarships for tuition, room, and board, I work to afford clothing and some of life’s other necessities.

My writing is primitive? At least they are my own words. I do not "steal" words (plagiarize) just to sound sophisticated. Besides, articulate writing is simple and well understood, not obnoxious. Many incoming Harvard students have problems with writing because of their use of “flowery” words. I know several students who had to take writing classes to simplify their writing (i.e. say more with less).

If you want to criticize writing, then make sure you improve your own writing:
- It is considered superfluous to start any paragraphs with words like “lastly.”
- “The theories that you espouse...” could be written “Your theories…”

Sincerely,
Harvard ’04 [Apparently too stupid to be from Moorestown but smart enough to attend Harvard]

--posted by Harvard '04 @ Wednesday, June 25 2003, 8:58 am EDT

Dear "MR." Moorestown Mom,

Response:

"Hey Harvard '04...Does your family tree go back as far to the ones that stole the Indians' land from them?" Answer: No.

"Do you remember the commercial where there was a tear in an Indian's eye because he saw trash floating in a stream? Were you on that stream rafting that day?"
Answer: No and no.

Additional comment: My family history has nothing to do with the discourse on the web site.

Sincerely,
Harvard ’04 [Apparently too stupid to be from Moorestown but smart enough to attend Harvard]

--posted by Harvard '04 @ Wednesday, June 25 2003, 10:52 am EDT

Lets not beat up Harvard '04 anymore, because while he is smart enough to attend Harvard, and his family and community are proud of him, he may not be smart enough to figure out the real issues in the case of Blair Hornstine without being first led to the trough.

The sarcasm evident in his two recent postings is a good indicator of his mind set. There is an air of arrogance to HIS WORDS. We need to remember that part, because he once again brings into the debate the issue of some news 'editorials' that have nothing to do with Ms. Hornstines' schoolwork in any way whatsoever. I would remind him, (if I was still beating up on him) that her school work was checked for plagiarism, and found to be completely free of any such issue. He totally missed the fact that Ms. Hornstines' editorials were read by the staff at the newspaper in question, and allowed to be published, although, according to said paper, they were aware of the quotes that were not credited. He has also missed the simple reality that had the newspaper staff simply done their jobs, Ms. Hornstines editorials would either not have appeared, or would have been EDITED. They were not.

We could, of course, advance a conspiracy theory; that the paper, knowing of the lawsuit, took advantage of Ms. Hornstines apparent lack of ethics, and published her writings fully aware of their intent to later lambast her with the error of her ways. Certainly, stranger things have happened in journalistic intrique recently. I'm reminded of the media free for all over Pfc. Lynch, and the whole sale retractions now being carefully worded by editors the world over. I'm reminded of liars who pose as journalists, and who invent their stories, another Blair comes to mind.

While we're at it, we could remind Harvard '04 that his post contains credit he assumed for the entire Havard student body and educators: "Choose another school besides Harvard. We really do not want you here. Your life will be miserable if you come." I am not aware that he was elected to speak for the student body, and am incredulous that he would presume to do so, what with being so busy working to buy clothes and things. It addition, in the same statement he implies that Ms. Hornstine may face retaliation and or actual physical danger if she does indeed go to Harvard. This statement alone makes me wonder what kind of morals Mr. Harvard '04 was brought up with by his schoolteacher father and homemaker mother.

It does matter that the Board and superintendant were wrong in the beginning. If they had not tried to deprive Ms. Hornstine of her rightful place at the head of her class, NONE of this would be happening. She was forced into court by a system that was not only wrong, it was also neglectful of it's edict to educate, equally, as opposed to advance the most popular candidate for the validictory. Ms. Hornstines actions can be seen in a lot of ways, but the simple fact of the matter is that had the 'powers that be' not tried to deprive her of what she worked so hard to obtain, we wouldn't have Harvard '04 to beat up.

In conclusion, it has long been my opinion that Harvard educated people have a way of looking down their noses at other folks. I could do that to, and what's more I can afford to do it from the loftiest of perches. There are plenty of "Ivy League" millionairs, and maybe one day our buddy will be one, but I'm willing to bet that Ms. Hornstine beats him to that title. Of course, I win outright, and damn, I didn't go to Harvard, or any other gilded institution with a long history and a short memory. What was it, 1998 that Harvard expelled 30+ students for PLAGIARISM?

I will stick to what I learned in kindergarten, not to throw stones at the window, not to assume anything, and not to attempt to raise myself above others in my thoughts or actions. As to my existence, well, like most folks who work for a living, I pay my bills, and I play on my toys, and walk the dogs, and so on. The fact that I do it from a 333 acre estate in Colorado, on top of a mountain, with a view of Crested Butte from my enclosed swimming pool/recreation room, under 5,000+ square feet of the most beautiful cabin you can imagine is secondary to the rest of my reality.

Get where I am Harvard '04, and then tell me what I have missed. Until then, perhaps the anger you have for 'privleged people' may be better served looking for better paying work, or at least a better directed attitude.

"Let he amongst you without sin, cast the first stone." Regardless of your religious upbringing, or belief, it it relevent. Let the one amongst us who has never done anything wrong condem Ms. Hornstine, but when it comes to her schoolwork, let us remember that it is without question, and that is ultimately why she was, is, and should have been the validictorian. As to the court of public opinion, really, when has that court ever mattered?

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Wednesday, June 25 2003, 18:47 pm EDT

Even Harvard makes mistakes when admitting some students. They do "expect" a percentage to flunk out...You must have been one of those students. Lucky you, that you made it past your Freshman year. I will discontinue contributing to Harvard if they don't improve their admission standards. The students that I recommend are proud to attend and love to work with the "new" students.They don't slash them before they meet them or accept words of others without getting all the facts. I am aware of many students just graduating who worked to keep themselves there but found time to help others. Then again, maybe these students were not on the cusp of admission.

Because Miss Hornstine has a successful father (nothing is wrong with a school teacher, but I understand that the income does not compare to a Judge), that does not mean that she should be taken less seriously or in the vernacular of the young, "dumped on."

Since Miss Hornstine's scholarship papers, school papers, etc. were checked with a fine tooth comb after the newspaper "scandal," perhaps, she should be believed. She has performed many, many wonderful tasks for the community, scored a 1570 on the SAT's , won numerous "large" scholarships, won awards for her participating in Mock Trials (don't give me..how did she do it if she couldn't go to school... you and I know that it is possible. You just don't "play" when you have free time), and in spite of her disability scored the highest GPA in a very competitive senior class. She was accepted in ALL of the Ivys plus Stanford. She is not a dummy. Give the kid a break. Obviously, all of the above survived the scrutiny of the nit-picking reviews that followed. Could YOU and a few others pass this type of review? No one is perfect. Even you, I bet, have a skeleton in your closet.

Be a bigger person. Befriend Ms. H if she chooses to attend Harvard. You might actually learn something. Miss H is a great young woman. Find it out!

--posted by "MR." MM @ Wednesday, June 25 2003, 18:59 pm EDT

There have been a few references to the school reviewing Blair's written work. Blair's spokesman said that there were no problems with Blair's work, but the only statement from the school (that I am aware of) is that the school has not looked into the issue.
http://www.southjerseynews.com/issues/june/m061303e.htm

Has there been a more recent announcement?

--posted by Dave @ Wednesday, June 25 2003, 19:50 pm EDT

Dave:

Not that I know of.

My guess is that we won't hear anything from the school about this issue as graduation is over with and the lawsuit completed (minus the damages section).

For better or worse, things will likely heat up again once the school year starts at Harvard.

-adam

--posted by Adam @ Wednesday, June 25 2003, 19:55 pm EDT

Even though I disagree with S-Douglas Smith, I respect the fact that she/he is focused on the issues and is debating the merits of Miss Hornstine's case. I can take criticism as they relate to my comments regarding Miss Hornstine. Let me be clear: (1) I really hope Blair Hornstine remains physically safe; the fact that police must guard her home is terribly sad. (2) I do not hate Blair Hornstine or wish her physical harm. (3) I do disapprove of some of her actions and am exercising my right to speak freely.

Mr. MM, in my opinion you are acting more spiteful than those you accuse of being hurtful:

"Even Harvard makes mistakes when admitting some students. They do 'expect' a percentage to flunk out...You must have been one of those students. Lucky you, that you made it past your Freshman year. I will discontinue contributing to Harvard if they don't improve their admission standards."

You have no basis for this comment unless you think Harvard should admit people on what someone like you considers politically correct thoughts instead of merit. Although my HS is not as prestigious as Moorestown, I was Valedictorian of my HS class with an SAT score that is comparable to Blair's. I worked hard like Blair to get into Harvard and like her I had higher admissions stats than the average admitted student. I believe your anger towards me caused you to criticize my intelligence instead of criticizing my thoughts. Based on merit both Blair and I deserved to be admitted to Harvard. I did not say Harvard should not have admitted Blair because she is stupid.

I did comment that I feel Blair should attend another school because she has gained negative notoriety in four issues of our student newspaper and many students at Harvard have lobbied the admissions office to have her offer rescinded. You have a right to think some Harvard students are wrong and mean spirited. You may be right. However, if Blair decided to skip her HS graduation because she did not want to face negative comments by her peers, then she probably will not want to face her peers at Harvard. I will not seek her out to chastise her. I will once again dedicate myself to studying, working, and preparing myself for life after graduation. Blair’s freshman classmates are the students she will have to deal with in class and social activities.

Mr. MM, I am criticizing your comments, but I do not think you, Mrs. MM, or S-Douglas Smith are not intelligent. You are probably twice my age so you might be wiser as a result of the experiences you have gained in life. If you want me to “give the kid a break” then show your wisdom by critiquing my comments instead of my intelligence [learn from S-Douglas Smith who pokes fun at some of my comments]. Please do not “discontinue contributing to Harvard” because you do not like my opinions. Believe it or not, diverse opinions in the classroom make Harvard a great place to learn.

--posted by Harvard '04 @ Wednesday, June 25 2003, 21:27 pm EDT

Ms/Mr. Harvard'04: I don't believe I have anything to add to the last two posts. They said just about all of it. The only thing that I politely point out to you are your words: "I earned my way to Harvard by working hard, achieving high grades, and by earning high test scores." Can you tell me where Blair was any different from you? Money or lack thereof do not change that sentence.

Please sleep on it. Maybe you can think clearer tomorrow.

--posted by Mrs. M.M. @ Wednesday, June 25 2003, 22:38 pm EDT

Dave: I understand your confusion. You have mixed your oranges with your apples..."There have been a few references to the school reviewing Blair's written work. Blair's spokesman said that there were no problems with Blair's work, but the only statement from the school (that I am aware of) is that the school has not looked into the issue." The first part of this sentence refers to MHS reviewing her work which is what the "spokesman" was referring to. The second part of the sentence about "the school has not looked into the issue" refers to Harvard. The last part of this sentence about Harvard, I believe, comes from an issue of the Harvard newspaper printed a few weeks ago. You're welcome!

--posted by Mrs. M.M. @ Wednesday, June 25 2003, 22:45 pm EDT

Harvard: As I read your new post...you knew I would comment....I refer to your comment " Blair decided to skip her HS graduation because she did not want to face negative comments by her peers," Blair could not attend her graduation because it, as originally planned, was to be outside. The administration, police, etc. could not guarantee her safety as graduation would be held on the football field - many ways to get in, no metal detectors, possibly more dangerous weapons than eggs and on and on. I need not specify anything more. There are lots of "crazies" out there.

Her class voted not to applaud after she spoke (not "negative comments by her peers").If you think that a few classmates/parents negative feelings had anything to do with her standing up there, you do not know Blair. Besides, there were many who supported her who wanted to come with large signs stating such. It could have been a match between supporters and non-supporters, not a graduation ceremony. I personally think that one of the reasons besides safety that forced Blair to make the decision not to attend was that without her attendance, there would be less of a chance of a "circus." Don't forget the press - local, national, print, tv, etc. were to attend. Without her, there would be less press, less aerials, less trucks and trailers and less worry --a more normal graduation would be held.

As it was inclement weather forced the ceremony inside at the last minute. Since it was a small area, each student was limited to a couple of tickets.
Since Blair's family, school officials, etc. did not know before the graduation that there would be inclement weather, she withdrew so that the graduation could be practiced in whole. In order words, she didn't want to count on rain nor did she want to leave a "hole" in the plans if she could not attend at the last minute.

Additional facts brought to you by Mrs. Moorestown MOM

--posted by Mrs. M.M. @ Wednesday, June 25 2003, 23:16 pm EDT

Harvard '04,

I would point out, (I'm thinking about beating up somebody), that I do not disagree with you about Blair's editorials, in that she should have credited, even if she did paraphrase, the original quotes. We diverge at this point however. I do not believe, because it was not school work, that her actions, though they should have been overseen, and EDITED by the EDITORS of the paper, should have ANY BEARING on her worthiness to attend Harvard. Further, fortunately, the student body at Harvard does not set admission standards, and likely, if she so chooses, Ms. Hornstine will be able to attend the school of her choice, without, I surmise, the attacks and personal vendettas that have been threatened by certain members of the student body at Harvard.

Blair's outstanding schoolastic accomplishments, and her charitable work aside, she is a fine example of truth being outweighed by opinion. Frankly, in the final analysis, opinion does not bear the weight of integrity, and cannot be used as a measure of worthiness. I would rather be truthful a thousand times, and poorly recieved, than popular once, and lose out on integrity.

It is exactly that core belief that has advanced me to where I am today. I do not have an Ivy League education, I have a local community college and then finished up at UCLA, education. I got okay grades, but I can tell you that my SAT's were no where near yours or Blairs. I did the best I could, and I'm proud of that, and my 3.79 GPA throughout college. I was considered smart, but I'm no genius. I worked my ass off for it, and got gray early staying up at all hours trying to figure out what the hell I was doing.

I paid for every class, I used my body, and my youth to do it, by joining the Marine Corps, and using the GI Bill, which paid about 1/3 of my expenses. I paid the rest out of my pocket. My parents could not have dreamed of putting me through school. I struggled, took 6 years to complete a four year degree, and a total of 10 years to get my Masters, but I got it. I started my little company in my fifth year. Today, nearly 20 years later, it is a national company, growing nicely, and established as a strong and outward looking concern. It has never advertised nationally, it has never run million dollar adds anywhere, it's branches advertise in the areas it serves, and it's primary customer service policy is simple, it's right or we buy it, period.

Our warranty is clear; if you can find a better performer, we'll buy it for you, if you have one of ours. If you can find a better built unit, we'll buy it for you, if you have one of ours. If you can find better service, a better support staff, or better quality anywhere, we'll buy it for you, if you have one of ours. For two years, we stand behind our product without the need for additional warranties, and if for some reason it'll take more than 3 days to repair something we're responsible for, we'll give you a state of the art loaner AT NO COST.

I do not compromise on quality, or service, and for the first years of my little business, many of my competitors cried foul because I would indeed point out the flaws of their products, and I would indeed show how mine were better, but I did it with actual physical proof, and I paid full boat for any product that I compared mine too. I was never sued, because the competitors knew it was ridiculous to try, I won market share based on truth, integrity, and by forcing the competition to compete at my level, instead of lowering myself to theirs.

And that, Harvard '04 is wisdom for you, and stubborness, and integrity, and the way to succeed. It is my hope that you learn such practices at Harvard, and it is my hope that you learn to set aside personal dislike in order to spur on the greater good. It is my hope that in your life you strive for excellence, and achieve peace in your soul, because if you do that, not only can you look in the mirror, you can do it without the need for looking behind you as you rise to the top. Are you the creme, or just another expensively educated, opinionated Ivy League wannabe?

So much for the lesson of the day.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Thursday, June 26 2003, 9:59 am EDT

Dear S. D-S, I think part of the reason I continue on this blog is to read your notes. You are a wise man. Some of your wisdom comes from education, I believe, but most of it is from intelligence and life's experiences. We can all hope that the many who write here gain knowledge from you and the world. Harvard '04 seems at some points to be tripping over his/her original thoughts. He/she must be listening to you. THAT IS GREAT! Good arguments with fact based opinions can be persuading.

Thank you for the time you spend sharing with us.

--posted by Mrs. M.M. @ Thursday, June 26 2003, 11:13 am EDT

MM: I did mean MHS when I referred to school statements that it has not looked into the plagiarism issue. The link to the article that I included in my earlier post should have made that clear. The article states:

"A lawyer for the township's school board on Thursday said school officials have not reviewed the written assignments of Blair Hornstine, contradicting statements by a spokesman for the girl's family. 'The school district has not looked into this issue at all,' said attorney John Comegno, referring to possible questions about Hornstine's written work."

--posted by Dave @ Thursday, June 26 2003, 12:29 pm EDT

Dear Mrs. MM,

You almost won part of me over when you were polite in your response, i.e. when you stated “ The only thing that I politely point out to you…” I apologize for the sarcasm in my original post, but you probably would have been more motivating if you complemented S. D-S without stating, that I am “tripping over my original thoughts.” Once again, this is your opinion and I disagree. I believe you misinterpreted my original thoughts as evil vs. mere opinion. I still disagree with S. D-S and you; I am just trying to be more clear and respectful about our disagreements as I thought S. D-S and you were starting to do. I was trying to set the tone that although I disagree with Blair’s actions, I am not an evil, disgruntled kid who hates successful people. I do understand that if you are as close to Blair as you seem to be that many of the comments about Blair probably hurt you as much as they probably sting Blair. I do understand human emotion and I honestly hope you are able to relax after your anger subsides. I stated my opinion, but I am not angry because I have more important things to worry about.

S. D-S,

Congratulations on your successes. I have checked out your web site and from what little I read about your business, you seem genuinely successful. I think it is great that you served as a Marine. My Dad served with the Marines in Vietnam. I hope we can respectfully agree to disagree.

All,

Parting thought: I am sure Blair’s parents did a good job raising their children because Adam Hornstine seems to be a very smart, decent person who had a good reputation at Harvard. Even though Blair now has a bad reputation at Harvard [maybe deserved, maybe not], the students were respectful to Adam and let him live his life normally. I never believed the parents were evil. I just disapprove of Blair’s use of the legal system [even if she was treated unfairly] to solve what I consider to be one of life’s trivial problems. Life has never been fair and never will be.

Thanks to Adam Tow for posting many facts and letting people post their opinions. This will probably be my last post for a few weeks as I am leaving for the wilderness to work and do some camping.

--posted by Harvard '04 @ Thursday, June 26 2003, 13:14 pm EDT

Dave: That is not the information that I received from an "authority." I was not there at the time, so I "won't" call the man a liar.

Harvard: You came across to me as "a person with an attitude because you did not have certain luxuries." I am sure that you are bright. I certainly do not have any of the hurting that the Hornstines probably suffered. I just want you and others to investigate the facts without emotion before you make your statements. If you don't think legal action was the solution to the problem, how would you have handled it? I don't believe from reading your comments here that you would just have rolled over and accepted "second, third or no best" from your school. You are proud of the work you did in HS,proud that you were Valedictorian, proud that you were #1 and proud that you were accepted in Harvard. You said that you worked hard for those things. Blair did, too. Would you really have wanted for yourself to be ignored? I don'think Blair did either.

Have a safe and wonderful trip. Put some thoughts into the past week or so of posting. Let me hear from you on your return. Hopefully, you will be more benevolent with regards to Ms. H.

--posted by Mrs. M.M. @ Thursday, June 26 2003, 15:49 pm EDT

A note about that website, it is a work (rework, rework, rework,) in progress. If you browsed it at all and went to the places menue, you would have found a great deal of information. But, I digress, thanks for looking, but this blog is not about my website.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Thursday, June 26 2003, 16:12 pm EDT

As a MHS Alum who is fairly close with the Hornstines, I've seen a lot of people make accusations, etc. that I feel fall far from the truth. Here is my take on the whole situation.

I think that a lot of people are pointing fingers at Moorestownians and making some pretty crappy allegations about the community's desire to discriminate against Blair Hornstine. I assure you that though Moorestown is an affluent community, the people who live here have a lot more class and maturity than Blair's sympathizers make us out to have. Yes, we all have a lot of priveleges, but Blair probably has even more than most Moorestownians. There are a number of physically and psychologically disabled children in the Moorestown school system - I graduated in the late nineties with some of them. Most of them actually attend the high school, and the high school goes out of its way to accomodate them. I saw it myself while I was there, and for a period of 6 months when I myself was confined to a wheelchair (when the school gave me free physical therapy in lieu of gym). The very fact that the Hornstines can afford to have one parent at home and to hire tutors, etc. shows the monetary privilege that Blair had over many disabled students. Because of this, she had the ability to take courses and tests on her time schedule, and to have people paid directly by her parents grade her papers. So when people say that she had some advantages that aren't shared by other students, they may not be so wrong. I certainly know other disabled MHS students who are confined to wheelchairs, etc. that could not afford to take advantage of every luxury provided by the law.

Furthermore, as a Moorestown resident and as someone who has dealt with the Hornstine family, I don't doubt for a second the stories that Judge Hornstine exerted his influence in this from the beginning, just as he has with anything his kids are involved with. Honestly, do you know any 18-year-old girls who can convince one of NJ's best mafia attornies to defend them PRO BONO? Would that have happened if she weren't a powerful judge's daughter? My inclination is to say no. I can't say I know everything that goes on behind the scenes, but I have seen Judge Hornstine flex his muscles and get his way more than a few times when it comes to his kids. Could or would most parents do many of the things he has done? Certainly not. Can I fault him for caring? No. But I also know that it is foolish to believe that he has nothing to do with the motivation or course of this lawsuit.

I think that I, and almost everyone in Moorestown, is over the issue of valedictorian. Like it or not, Blair is technically valedictorian, but the salutorian essentially claimed all the privileges of valedictorian - he was on the news, he gave the speech, and he is revered in the community as the top student in the class. So the wound in the community regarding that aspect has healed. What makes people so angry, and this is mostly parents, not students, is Blair's pursuit of monetary damages. The Hornstines are not short on money at all, and as it has been pointed out, Blair's tuition has been covered by scholarships. The idea of someone who built their reputation through committment to the community suing for nearly $3 million from a public school district leaves a lot of people feeling used and angry. It is hard to reconcile those two aspects of her personality. Plus, the pursuit of compensatory damages is somewhat ridiculous. Economic loss from having to share valedictorian status is negligible, if existant at all. Even with shared status, Blair could run around for the rest of her life telling everyone that she was valedictorian, and she'd be right, and no one would question it. (Not that being valedictorian of a public high school means anything at Harvard.) The punitive damages are also very offensive, in that the township and the school have been punished enough by the legal fees and embarrassment that the Hornstines have brought to them to make sure that this sort of thing never happens again. Taking any more money is simply theft from the taxpayers in this town and the students that have yet to go through the school system.

Do I think she deserved to be SOLE valedictorian? No. Should it be shared? yes. Being home schooled and going to a public high school are two totally different experiences. Neither is better or worse, or harder or easier, but they are like apples and oranges. IE, waiting at the busstop at 6AM or being made fun of in the lunch room or having the pressure of a big sports game is different than taking classes in your living room, but going to school healthy is different than having CFS. To name one winner (valedictorian) out of two separate games is not logical. But at this point, no one really cares about that. People are angry about the pursuit of damages and the way that Moorestown has been portrayed. Neither of them seem very genuine.

--posted by MHS grad @ Friday, June 27 2003, 17:05 pm EDT

For a MHS grad who thinks she know it all (I hope I don't know you...), you are so so mislead on facts. Where do you get such ridicilous information? I am quoting you...
"The very fact that the Hornstines can afford to have one parent at home and to hire tutors, etc. shows the monetary privilege that Blair had over many disabled students. Because of this, she had the ability to take courses and tests on her time schedule, and to have people paid directly by her parents grade her papers."

Where do you hear such rubbish? Just because Mrs. H. is a stay at home Mom? What does that mean? What does that have to do with anything? And furthermore, THE MOORESTOWN BOARD OF EDUCATION PAID FOR HER TUTORS,ETC. not the Hornstines. You know NADA!

You had to follow the rules at MHS, Blair had to follow the rules at MHS. Why should the administration be exempt from doing so.

Grad, you are listening to the wrong people. You have your priorities upside down. You don't know what you are talking about.

The Money???? Better read the laws of this country. Discrimination and the Disability Act provide for damages if someone is not treated fairly according to the laws of this great nation. Please go back to school. Please get your facts straight. I hope that I had no experiences with you. You are an embarrassment to MHS.

Please, please,please keep your mouth shut. The more you say like above, the more you look like a (excuse me)a JACKASS. (I can't help using such a word, even though it is not in my usual vocab).

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Friday, June 27 2003, 17:33 pm EDT

MHS: You bothered me so that I couldn't help writing more...Where did you get such an idea that her attorney was working PRO BONO? Don't count on it. Also, you blamed her Father because he is a Judge for orchestrating this suit. Of course, her Father is a lawyer. Of course, he may be more familiar with the law than you. What do your parents do? Plumber, well, I am sure he is more familiar with what kind of toilet to buy, how to fix it, etc. A shoemaker, well, he knows what kind of soles, etc. are better. A teacher? An electrician? A Piano tuner? An Artist? Now don't you think that a child of one of the above has his/her parents' expertise?

I do believe you are carrying the negative sentiments of many of the glorious gossips of Moorestown. You had a better education if you attended MHS. THINK FOR YOURSELF AND FIGURE IT OUT!!! STOP TELLING UNTRUTHS!

--posted by Mrs..mm @ Friday, June 27 2003, 19:21 pm EDT

You lie....you are not pretty close to the Hornstine family or you wouldn't say such things. You know nothing "real" about them.

--posted by p.s. @ Friday, June 27 2003, 19:22 pm EDT

Well, Grad brings up some interesting things. She claims it was two seperate "games" as if Blair didn't have to take the same courses, or something along those lines. Apparently, being home schooled makes it easier for one to get better grades. The fact that Mr. Mirkin could have had a statistically higher GPA is totally ignored. Of course, after telling us how wonderful the community is she proved our initial disdain by indicating how he has been embraced by the community, and accepted as the "Validictorian" even though Blair is the student with the highest GPA. What Grad has proven is that in a popularity contest, Blair is not Barbie. She certainly hasn't done anything to establish Moorestown as some misunderstood community. In actuality what she has done is illustrated the differences between a "regular Joe" community, and an "affluent community".

The Americans With Disabilities Act was enacted to protect people with disabilities from being discriminated against. Using Blair's status as a disabled student as a mean to deprive her of her rightful gains is discrimination. That is exactly what the school board, which on one side of it's mouth said "here, this IEP is in keeping with the school educational plan, thus it is equal", and then, when the popular boy was found to be statistically lacking, it decided that the equal plan it created was actually slanted to Blair. Except it wasn't. It clearly showed that it was possible for Mr. Mirkin to recieve higher marks. Of course, the fact that he didn't shouldn't be held against him, because he's the popular boy.

Poppycock.

Blair was the rightful Validictorian, she was discriminated against by the school board, and then the community more or less seconded that notion by trying to assist in the changes by loudly endorsing them, in essence encouraging the school board to further the discriminatory process. Now, of course, since they lost, they're denying that discrimination was the intent.

Poppycock.

The fully intended to deprive her, based upon her physical condition, the rightful title of Validictorian, and any status, privledge and alcolades that go with it. They fully intended to prevent her from sharing, or having any of the rights and honors that such a title would bring her. They fully intended to take this good student, and replace her with the popular choice, damn the rules, and damn anything else. It's like not letting you into a club because you're an affluent overprivledged child with no concept of life in the realworld, and a bad case of acne. Not letting you in because of Acne is discrimination. All the rest is speculation. Your being denied access because of a physical condition is discrimination. It's not apples and oranges, it's discrimination, period.

Until Moorestown accepts that, regardless of all the Mafia attorneys and everything else, Moorestown will continue to miss the boat on reality, and ultimately, will find itself in the bankruptcy courts seeking protection from it's private creditors, like Ms. Hornstine. East St. Louis comes to mind, a town owned lock stock and barrel by a woman whose son was killed wrongfully by the police. She of course, disbanded the police department first thing. Smart woman.

I wonder what Moorestown would look like if it was renamed Blairstown, and more importantly, I wonder, if it came to that, if even then, Moorestown residents would get it?

DISCRIMINATION, IT'S AGAINST THE LAW!

Figure it out, Grad, or continue to make what appears to be unrepentent, repugnant and arrogant statements about what you think you know. If you knew half as much as you think you do you would be a wise person, and if you paid half as much attention to the facts as you did to painting your rose colored glasses picture of the city and people of a town that at some point lost touch with reality, you would be brilliant.

As it is, you've made yourself into a burned out bulb, much the way Moorestown may be, if the entire 2.7 million is awarded. Personally, I think it should be. And then some, so that petulant people like Grad would be left paying every year for pretty much ever, as a reminder of what is and is not discrimination. At least, if a judgement is granted against Moorestown, the people will pay equally based on their assessments, the only difference being the values of their houses for tax purposes. Of course, the Hornstines will pay a proportionately higher amount, given that they have a much more expensive home than some other Moorestown citizens.

The rain falls equally, people, it's up to you how to utilize it.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Friday, June 27 2003, 20:02 pm EDT

S. d-s: I love to read your thoughts. You say what I think so eloquently.

I am sorry that we will suffer and slings and arrows of our discrimination in our pocketbooks. It is a terrible punishment for us, but one that ALL OF MOORESTOWN DESERVES. Mea Culpa, Moorestown.

TO ALL MY FELLOW MOORESTOWN RESIDENTS, STUDENTS, NON-BELIEVERS IN BURINGTON, CAMDEN COUNTIES: MHS is trying hard to educate its student. We are a top public school with top students. Somehow though, you are missing the boat. Don't you yet see what is wrong with you and your thoughts. You/We deserve to pay this 2 plus million dollar penalty. You are still discriminating...You have formed a "popular front" for a student who was more popular.

Definition of "popular front:" : a coalition especially of leftist political parties against a common opponent; specifically : one sponsored and dominated by Communists as a device for gaining power

THIS IS WHAT YOU HAVE BECOME!

--posted by Mrs. MM @ Saturday, June 28 2003, 0:39 am EDT

Pressure…

An interesting concept, that pressure thing. I need to address that Pressure part of MHS Grad’s post. I think we need to have a Pressure based seminar regarding what REAL pressure is, versus the inconceivable pressure of being a Moorestownian student at MHS and having to be up at the bus stop at 6 a.m. I think we need to give a reality check before it’s too late to stop the misconceptions of life that are so obvious in that post, and in those thoughts. Pressure… feel it building?

“IE, waiting at the bus stop at 6AM or being made fun of in the lunch room or having the pressure of a big sports game is different than taking classes in your living room…”

I wonder what would happen to MHS Grad if he/she had to experience the pressure of a parent who beat him/her severely every time the hint of failure intruded upon the parent’s idea of normalcy? I wonder what he/she would feel like to have the majority of the student body treat him/her like a pariah, and direct scorn in his/her direction simple because of his/her existence?

I wonder how MHS Grad would feel having to come home from school and basically run the house and become the ‘parent’ because the parents are addicted to drugs or alcohol, or are so wrapped up with their own delusions that the fact of children is somehow lost or left behind on the dusty floor of their own failed childhood? I wonder how he/she would deal with pressure of society painting him/her into a corner of enforced poverty, and created class systems by the very nature of a judgmental, but allegedly enlightened public? I wonder how MHS would feel to be the butt of every joke, and the basis for every prank, damn the results, or how it makes him/her feel? I wonder how this supposedly privileged person would react to REAL LIFE and REAL ISSUES, and REAL PRESSURE? Don’t you wonder?

There are kids that would love to worry about a “big game” or what dress to wear to a prom, or any of a million other things that normal teenagers worry about, but they can’t. They’re too busy dealing with the circumstances that life has dealt them, and with the presumptive reality that the streets provide. Is it real life, yes! Is it reality, no, because the exaggeration of life on the streets makes it, by its very nature, larger than life, and to survive you not only have to overcome the PRESSURE, but you have to thrive on it. To these kids a big test is nothing, they don’t study for it, they don’t have time, because they’re too busy surviving. They don’t worry about the big game, to them the big game is where they find the next meal, or next dry bed to sleep in, because the one that they’re not affluent parents provided is stuffed in the corner of a broken down leaky trailer stuck out in the middle of hell’s half acre, covered in vermin, and full of broken dreams. They know what pressure is, and sometimes they even have to face death from that life.

Recently, there have been several examples of not being able to deal with such pressures. The constant ridicule of the unpopular child, children led directly to the shootings at Columbine, and a myriad of other schools. The constant picking by the “upper class” in a public school setting is well documented. How many more innocent children will die, and how many more innocent children will find the need to bring a gun to school to settle once and for all the vicious assaults upon their dignity that our supposedly enlightened and ‘gentle’ children will inflict?

That’s pressure.

Getting ready for a big game is butterflies. Getting up and waiting for a bus a 6AM is just the early bird getting the worm. MHS Grad sounds like he/she thinks that getting up early is merely the purview of the affluent, or healthy. It is also the purview of the weak, the innocent, and the needy. Have you, MHS Grad, ever been up at 3AM walking the streets, outcast and depressed, willing yourself to take one more step, or telling yourself that you can make it, not matter what anyone says?

Pressure is not some game, or a test, pressure is every day life for far more students than you would imagine. Pressure is being treated like sh*t because of your race, or your religion, or your presumed differences, being judged by a peer group that wouldn’t know what reality was if it fell out of the sky and landed on their collective heads en-masse at a sports venue while they prepared in the stands to take a big test, while conversely discussing whose booty was nicer, or who looked better, or who had a nicer body. It would never occur to them that the shadow figure at the end of the stands is someone who has never been accepted for who they are; someone who struggles with far more than what to wear, and who to be seen with.

Life is a harsh reality, and so few rise above the pressure of it to actually succeed. Those that are generally successful are by and large the products of a wealthy home, whose families possess greater value contacts than the ones left behind. They have the better educations, and the better cars, and the better “circle of influential friends”. The ones who are ultimately successful in the day to day aspect of life though, have learned to deal with and direct the pressure of their youths into a drive and ambition unmatched by these other, “more privileged” children. And those are the ones that one day turn around and support the very school system that ignored them, let them suffer, and let them be mistreated by the hateful “upper class” of the system, because to intervene meant having to deal with the very parents that created these monstrous youth in the first place.

Pressure, MHS, is learning to be humane in an inhumane world. It is learning to be selfless in a selfish world. It is learning to be a part of the greater good instead of a part of the general “me first” mentality that goes with being in school. It goes to tolerance and to acceptance, instead of attacking what you can’t see, ((CFS)), and to understanding the real nature of discrimination, and calling it what it is, instead of ducking the issue and supporting the popular choice instead of the right one. It goes to integrity, and principle, and honesty, and if there is one thing missing, in my mind, in Moorestown, it would be the embracement of these simple truths, in lieu of being part of the community by ignoring the vicious and sustained attack upon right by the popular front that eventually was adjudicated and dismissed as lacking even the moral standard of integrity that would have prevented such an abuse of power as we have seen in this case.

Regardless of the final settlement, and regardless of the perceptions of popularity, and of a communistic approach to achievement; ((every five year plan in communist Russia/USSR failed) and every effort set forth by the Communist Chinese and the North Koreans has failed, and the people oppressed and down trodden become more so, while the powers that be tighten their grip upon the backs of the innocents who didn’t ask or volunteer to be the footstools of arrogance.); the outcome will be the same. Those without a dog in the fight will sit back and judge the town, and its people with a clear perspective that those within can not have. They will find, as a judge did, the people, and the establishment in Moorestown lacking, and responsible for a grave injustice heaped upon the head of an innocent whose only crime was intelligence, and whose only foul was irrelevant in the scheme of things.

I ask again; when will we ever learn?

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Saturday, June 28 2003, 8:54 am EDT

8th paragraph, last sentence: Not should be no, as in "no matter what anyone thinks."

I strove to make that post suitable for framing as a reminder to those who just don't get it, the difference between reality and arrogant presumption.

I apologise for this mistake.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Saturday, June 28 2003, 9:02 am EDT

oh and paragraph 3, simple should be simply... my bad, I guess I should have spent more time dealing with grammar and spelling and less time surviving while I was in school.

By the way, I'm doing this after the fact spellcheck because I just know some sniper post is going to show up without anything to say about the body of my post, and attack a few errors of editing that I failed to catch. I beat you to it, you snipers... go find something else to pick at...

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Saturday, June 28 2003, 9:08 am EDT

I will admit that I do not have all the facts so I am sincerely giving the benefit of the doubt to Blair since she won the court case. She was and is the MHS Valedictorian becuase the court ruled so, just like George W Bush is the President because the court ruled so. Our country has the best judicial system in the World, so we should accept and abide by the courts rulings. Blair is the Valedictorian so get over it everyone!

Now, although I support Blair as the true Valedictorian, I am a bit disturbed about the monetary suit against the school district. I will accept the court's ruling on this part of the case too, but since the court has not ruled on this yet, I will state my opinion. I personally do not believe monetary damages should be awarded except in cases where people can prove things like medical malpractice resulting in death/injury, loss of income, physical pain and suffering, etc. that occurred BEFORE the case was brought to court. I do not believe that Blair would have truly suffered had she had to share the award. I am NOT saying she should have shared the award; I am just saying that prior to the case going to court there was minimal true pain and suffering.

Right now the score = Blair 1; MHS 0. She won. I belive that if Blair does not drop the monetary part of the case [and she wins] the score will become Blair 1; MHS 1. I would hate for the resentment to increase against Blair in her hometown just becuase of some stupid money. Blair should go after Kadri (maybe sue to get him fired) or work hard to get the school board voted out next election time. I do not believe the individual taxpayer [most of whom are totally uninvolved] should have to pay higher taxes or that the kids who are in the school now should have to undergo larger class sizes or get programs cut.

I agree Blair got screwed and probably deserves to be the Valedictorian, so please do not be mean as to attack me and call me a jackass like you did another poster [even though this person was largely off base]. I do think Blair won and is the Valedictorian and she should be pleased with that. All the nastiness AFTER the court case was filed is legally irrelevant. Blair should learn from the civil rights movement where African Americans sued to get into state colleges and were admitted. They won their cause and that was noble enough. They paved the road for other African Americans and those who followed should be grateful for that. They did not sue for money even though many segregationists gave these African Americans a hard time.

As far as the "The Americans With Disabilities Act" she already won and this case can be used as a precedent to protect others with disabilities. Winning $3million will not further the enforcement of this Act as other school districts will abide by the Act because of the court's first ruling.

Disclaimer: I am just an average person so I know I am not an educated intellectual nor do I claim to be. I am not trying to be humble; I just want people to realize I am not a lawyer, a professor, or genuis so take my posting for what it is worth: A non-expert opinion.

Advice: Share facts and opinions with each other. Do not be so mean to each other.

--posted by A Humble Man's Perspective @ Saturday, June 28 2003, 9:26 am EDT

the thing that bothers me most about the hornstine story is not what blair or her father did(these things are to be expected). what i find astonishing is that our court system, let alone our school system, can be manipulated in this way. why on earth would a court even agree to hear such a case, ever? i grew up in a rural area where many people had no indoor plumbing and quite a few children had no shoes. as an adult i have traveled to many places that made even my poor upbringing seem luxurious. so to file a court case over whether or not one will be fantastically privileged or just fantastically privileged and actually have it heard wasting the courts time and taxpayers money is outrageous. where in the court and school systems are the balls? jim myers

--posted by james h. myers @ Saturday, June 28 2003, 11:22 am EDT

So, James Myers, we should just let the school system deprive people of things because they can, right? If that's the case, then we can deprive people of their civil rights, and make it okay to just discriminate at will, because it's manipulating the courts?

As to your upbringing, sounds not unlike mine, but James, live on a Reservation some time, like I have, and tell me about squallor, or deprivation.

It's a waste of time and money to insure equality, and rightful placements? It's a waste of money and time to actually enforce rules that garantee equality in education? It's a lack of balls to actually do the right thing?

And then, you people have the audacity to bitch about a judgement of this nature? If you weren't so content to let a child be discriminated against in the first place, privileged or not, then we wouldn't have such lawsuits, becuase right would be right and wrong would be wrong, and none of us would have to wonder which side we're on.

Narrow minded views on things like discrimination is why discrimination exists in the first place. To call it a waste of taxpayer money, and court time, (which serves at our whim, not the other way around), is almost as stupid as trying to twist the truth as it has been in this case from the outset, but the school board which without the possibility of legal sanction, would be more orless free to do whatever it wanted. In this case, deprive Ms. Hornstine her rightful entitlement, but what, sir, if it was your son? Would you be so ready to ignore it then?

Narrow minded mentality creates the need for such legal relief, and until that mentality shifts, the courts will have to rule in the favor of the wronged part, and that is not a waste of time, when dignity and integrity are involved.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Saturday, June 28 2003, 12:19 pm EDT

Humble Man: Blair suffered for many months because the school WOULD NOT CONSIDER her to be valedictorian,made fun for many months in school, specifically intimidated during a public meeting of the class, etc. It went on and on.Then the threats began, the paint balling and obscentities painted, etc. The laws of the ADA mandate that she is entitled.

Should other students suffer? NO. Should community members and parents be more interested in what the school is doing? YES. It is a hard lesson for this community. Other communities have learned lessons, too,.....much harder ones. Ask the residents of Columbine. Children DIED, Children injuried mentally and physically for life....Money was taken from the school district there, too. Community members learned a tougher lesson. Has Blair suffered? Of course. She earned a right to speak at graduation, but because of situations like Columbine, her safety could not be guaranteed. She gets egged, booed, had to leave town, etc. Oh, this is minor, you say. Compared to death, it is....BUT IT IS THE LAW. SHE IS AND WAS BEING DISCRIMINATED UPON.

I am very generally comparing Columbine to Moorestown. Thank goodness there were no deaths in Moorestown. The comparison I am attempting to make is
lack of community interest cost both communities lots of money. I assure you that the residents of Columbine take more of an interest in their schools now and the school administration. It cost them, oh so much. It is time for Moorestown to take the bull by the horns, accept their (only financial ) punishment and progress. Their (Moorestown) treatment of the entire Hornstine family (either because of resentment, dislike, finances, etc) is no different than discriminating against the Black Man, the American Indian, the Jewish people, etc. The only difference, as I see it, is that this is one family. I have also heard this case referred to as a case of Anti-Seminism. I hope not.

Jim Myers: IF this is wasting the court system, so are parking tickets, driving without a license, underage drinking, insider trading, etc. I purposely did not use crimes of passion, murder, rape, etc.
Are laws made to be broken? I hope not. The ADA law took many years to structure. It is a good law and benefits many. Because you may not understand, don't
criticize something that benefits so many.This is not privilege unless you consider our laws privileged. The poor or rich are treated equally.

And now a note about the Hornstine father. He may be a judge and learned in the ways of the law. Many things can be said about him, but he certainly is not the WITCH and B*TCH that the Mother of Mr. Mirkin is. DON'T YE EVER FORGET, IT WAS THE MOTHER OF KEN MIRKIN WHO BEGAN ALL THIS. Allow her to take most of the blame for the school cuts next year.

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Saturday, June 28 2003, 12:21 pm EDT

Everyone:

Jonathan Last, a former MHS student, writes an article about the Hornstine case in the latest issue of The Weekly Standard:

http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/002/852lodkv.asp

In the spirit of open debate, Jonathan raises some facts which have not been touched on or have been disputed by some commentors on this web site.

Thanks to Kimberly Swygert of Number 2 Pencil for alerting us on this article.

-adam

--posted by Adam @ Saturday, June 28 2003, 14:43 pm EDT

I'm looking at the Weekly Standard story now and am stunned at the paragraph discussing what looks very much to me like "gradesmithing" where, according to the story, a Latin class was taken twice, a PE grade of A was eliminated and the appearance of droping a class to hold out for a teacher that would more readily deliver an A+. If this is true, I'm looking at a contemptable and dishonorable run on playing the system. And if true, any sympathy I had for the school board and certainly any I may have initially held for the Hornstines has totally evaporated. It takes two to tango.

--posted by Bill @ Saturday, June 28 2003, 16:07 pm EDT

I will give some credit where credit is due, in that Jonathan Last gave some "what appear to be mitigating" facts, which are really speculative in nature to support his writing, which on the surface appears to be balanced and fair, but which of course is not.

He mentions dropped classes, which were addressed in Judge Wolfsons' ruling, and he fails to mention any actions that Mr. Mirkin made to support his own academic standings. While Mr. Last does a great job of painting the 'overall' mindset in Moorestown, he fails to balance his story with documentation of things Mr. Mirkin is said to have done, or things that appear to be biased towards Blair.

The school system did try to deprive Blair, and failed, but the town of Moorestown didn't fail, through their childish and threatening antics and statements they achieved what Mr. Kadri could not, and that was depriving Blair of her rightfully earned honor.

That the issue of alleged plagiarism comes up at all in this account is the most telling. It has no basis in fact for the finalization of her standing, and is something used to muddy waters, but not something that has bearing, legally, or morally, in this case. While pointing out all of the flaws of Blair's writing for the paper, never once does Mr. Last address the issues of guidance other than to say "she had none", which supports the very point I've made repeatedly, that if the paper had done it's job, Blair’s statements or theft of them, if you will, would never have been published.

Does this indicate a bias to set Blair up, maybe, but what it proves beyond doubt is that the paper itself as a self policing entity, lacks the moral backbone to take responsibility for it's lack of editorial guidance and control regarding Ms. Hornstine, and shows the failure of the editorial system within it's walls is a disservice to any who read it.

Finally, regardless of what you may think or want to believe, (want being the operative word here), about Blair's father, he simply provide within his means what he could to protect his daughters interests, but because he is well connected legally, now he's also to be attacked. No body raised hell when Ken Griffey Jr. became a superior ball player than his father, although his father provided him with all the tools that 99.9% of the other children playing could not have. Or Barry and Bobby Bonds.

When a father gives his child the support of his whole self, that is something to be embraced and respected, unless you live in Moorestown, and are named Hornstine, then it's judicial manipulation. It's like this, Mr. Last gave all the Kadri LIES about Mr. Hornstine a total of 9 paragraphs in his little missive, alternately playing the sympathy game, and then snatching away the prize, while burying the damning truth in a one paragraph, disjointed sentence which exposes Mr. Kari’s lies for what they were. Typical bore you with bull and then drop the bomb, by the time you get there; you're too tired to pay attention.

Mr. Last has made a lasting impression upon me, with is unsupported, except in areas he wanted to "make his mark" (which are each addressed in the ruling, I might add). He has laid out a horror story about the Hornstine s, going lightly on the threats, the allegations and destruction of private property. The fear under which Blair has to exist. But boy, when it comes to the one thing which has no bearing on this case at all he gives it a presumptive opening, and then declares it to be a victory of sort that depicts Blair's real personality, while forgetting to point out that the newspaper stuff has no bearing on the valedictory, and that the newspaper itself failed to edit and prevent the very abuses he accuses her of. Let’s face it, this isn't made up stuff, there was plenty of ways to verify her documentation or lack of it, the paper simply did not do it.

It goes to Bill, who apparently hasn't read the judgment so isn't aware that what he terms gradesmithing was addressed in court, and found to be totally blown out of proportion by the board, particularly Mr. Kadri’ s attempts to deprive Blair of her place at the head of the class. His characterizations of this NON ISSUE make it seem like Blair did something wrong, she did not, she simply could not take the in school portions of classes and had to therefore drop them, in order to take a class that did not have requirements that could be fulfilled in the home. Labs and such. Of course, if one subscribes to Mr. Lasts' position that Mr. Hornstine is over indulgent, then one would believe that he would have built her a lab in the house that rivals or even improved upon the one at the school.

Mr. Last has taken the strongest points of the Boards' claims, and amplified them, while at the same time de-emphasizing the realities of the actions that fostered the final decision made by Judge Woflson, once again minimizing the dreadful wronging and outright lies of Mr. Kadri, while at the same time elevating secondary actions of the plaintiff, Ms. Hornstine, to mythic proportions and slanderous ridicule, when in reality, they have nothing whatsoever to do with the basis of the case, and that was, I remind you, that Blair Hornstine had a higher GPA than Ken Mirkin, and was deprived of that honor by a school administrator and finally a town, bent on elevating the supposedly unfairly disadvantaged Mr. Mirkin to a place he didn't earn over a disabled, (and not speculatively so) person.

The school board has Blair's diagnosis, and frankly, it may be the one thing that is clear in this case. Regardless of what you wish to think, Blair Hornstine is not altogether healthy, and CFS is a clearly defined specific illness, which doesn't mark it's victims with obvious pointers to it's existence. It's easy to call its victims lazy, but then again, it's easy to miss all the tell tale signs of HIV infection, too, because they're so many of them that are obvious from the outside, right?

Maybe that's why the WHO expects 400,000 new HIV infections this year in the United States, 90% of them in high school age children, and 86% of them in white, middle class school districts.

Bias is bull, but Last gave it a good try, and at least twisted the facts with creativity, as opposed to outright animosity.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Saturday, June 28 2003, 17:58 pm EDT

I apologize. Not to anyone on this web site but to Miss Hornstine. She is just a kid though I have this feeling she is a very tough kid. My comments were insensitive and uncalled for. She has accomplished something that most people can only dream of. I'll just leave it at that.

--posted by L. Walker @ Saturday, June 28 2003, 19:20 pm EDT

And just where in the case ruling (which I DID read) does it explain the twice-baked Latin 1 then? I see AP GPA scoring examples using Latin 1 but even then it doesn't follow. Taking a course like that twice (even standard vs AP) through the k-12 sequence would only follow if the first round was unacceptable either by her own performance (unlikely given that she appears to be a stellar student) or substandard delivery of the first round of L1 (where doubling up of L1 would be more common contrary to the stated point in question). Explain, if you could. If you want to play flame war, I lack the patience. All I want (and I imagine others want) the context of that part of the WS article (that we can't find in the ruling, BTW, I don't see her transcripts which wouldn't be in there anyway). It's clear that the Hornstine court case is valid given the inept conduct of the school board. What is in question and in the long run more important is the demeanor of her curriculum. In other words was her life preparation more important to her and family than her grade points and valedictory status? Because from all perspectives, no matter how deep I look into both sides (and believe me I have despite your smug presumption), all I see is the latter rising to the surface. And that scares me for her sake.

--posted by Bill @ Saturday, June 28 2003, 21:47 pm EDT

Bill,

Sorry, I don't flame. I take the time to respond fully, and address certain issues. As to your 'twice baked latin, you know what, I don't know, but what I do know is that if she took it in eighth grade and then retook it, it may be because the earlier score did not count towards her cumlitive GPA. That is just a thought, not a written in stone answer to that particular question, which, for the record, I find valid. The question of the other classes she dropped are dealt with in the ruling.

You can call me smug, I'm all for it, because if you've read this board, you have an idea of where I come from. I've seen conditions that make homelessness appealing. I've lived in them, and if that makes me smug, so be it, I can afford to be wrong, smug, and completely biased without fear of retaliation, after all, who I am has no bearing on this situation.

I suppose what I take exception to in your post is simply the withdrawal of support for the Hornstines based on what appears to me, with Mr. Lasts' story, to be based on speculation and implication. Who cares what attorney Mr. Hornstine hired. He got a good one, isn't that what matters? Who cares that he's a judge, in this case he was wrongfully accused of things he clearly didn't do, and secondarially is being accused of manipulating the system. While such allegations are easy to make, they smack of slander with malicious intent. Mr. Kadri lied about Mr. Hornstine, and was caught in that lie, (actually, lies), and yet Mr. Kadri is seen as a sort of peoples hero in Moorestown. What does that tell you about Moorestown?

The wrong was perpatrated by the school board, and the city joined in, almost unanimously because Blair was simply not the popular choice, and because she had a board approved, administered and established IEP. She was the victim, and frankly, until people start accepting that reality, what you call flame wars will pop up all over the place.

Regardless of personal preferance, discrimnation is wrong, and that is what this is about.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Saturday, June 28 2003, 23:57 pm EDT

If anyone is still interested, Elaine Showalter wrote a very interesting book about things like CFS (which is very far from a "clearly defined specific illness" called "Hystories". Anyone with a truly compromised immune system would avoid China.

I think Blair is a loathsome little toad and her father a great big sack of shit.

--posted by Karen @ Sunday, June 29 2003, 17:03 pm EDT

I once wrote an interesting take on HIV, then my brother got infected. I once had interesting thoughts about Scleroderma, then my cousins husband died after contracting it seven months earlier. Ryan White and his family were outcasts in Acadia Florida when they recieved the HIV virus in blood products. What all of this has in common with Blair Hornstine is that these diseases are or were once misunderstood. MS was laziness, Crons disease was irriatable bowel syndrome.

Blair gets tired easily. So now she's a toad. Her father is a sack of sh*t. Wow!

I think people who refuse to look beyond the pale are pointless wastes of flesh, and resources. Be thankful you don't work for me Karen, if you did, I'd fire you for cause, just because, I can. I think you're a loathsome, pitiful excuse for a human being who has forgotten what compassion, reality, and integrity are. People like you should live in countries like Russia, or better yet, Iran, or Syria, where mouths like yours would be silenced before they get out of control, and where opinions like yours, based on emotions instead of reality, are quashed before they see the light of day.

I'm a chauvinist, I think women who can not make educated and balanced remarks should be marked with a giant I on their forheads, (for insolent, immature ignorant idiots.) I think you're a buffoon, who is either jealous of the success of Blair Hornstine, or who's father has had to face Judge Hornstine and been sentenced under the laws to some kind of situation that you just don't agree with.

I think you're arrogant, and foolish, and generally an all around twit with no socially redeeming values, and nothing to set you apart from the other bandwagon riding anti reality Blair hating twits who have no concept of right or wrong, and no ability to determine the difference between the two.

I think you think you know it all, and that you have no experience with orphan diseases like CFS or Schleroderma, or Crons Disease, or other autoimmune diseases that don't strike lots of folks. I'll bet you think lupis is a kind of animal. That would be a grave mistake.

I also think that people like you who judge based on anger, emotional distress, and general buffoonary should spend one week with all the symptoms of Blair's disease, and that you should all have to walk at least 100 miles in her shoes. At the end of that week and 100 miles if you still feel like this is a hoax, then fine, at least you'll have a leg to stand on, until then all you have is speculation of a manufactured ailment that you don't believe exists because it doesn't have outward symptoms. Well, I can think of about a million other maladies that don't exhibit outward signs, that we don't question. Start with HIV infection, (before AIDS), think of bone cancer, or other cancers, think of prostate cancer, or breast cancer in women, that by the time you "feel" it as a lump may already be too advanced to save you.

As for slandering Mr. Hornstine, well, you're probably just jealous, or you've had to deal with him on the bench. I've heard he's tough. You're probably mad because you screwed up, but he sentenced you. You can't relate the fact that you screwed up to him doing his job can you. You shouldn't have screwed up, then you would have no reason to think anything of him. Typical anti judge reaction, person screws up, is found guilty of said screwup, and blames the judge for the consequences, instead of themselves for the actions in the first place.

Bitter people should have to drink bitter water, that way the face you wear on the inside will be well displayed on the outside.

Twits. Who needs you? Lemming mentality in the case of twits should be mandatory. I would lead the drive to the cliffs, just to watch you, Karen, go over the side.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Sunday, June 29 2003, 17:49 pm EDT

Dear Karen: Showater's book compares CFS to Gulf War Syndrome and other diseases. Please write your twitty comments to our Armed Forces and see how they feel about your comments. I quote from a review of the book: "Hystories is an imperfect book. But it gets us thinking: about how skeptics might understand real emotional problems without making believers into demented loonies, about how much attention we should pay to our culture when trying to explain false beliefs,..."

Professor Showater must have been thinking of you when she referred to "demented loonies."

And, I heard that Blair and her Father would not insult a toad by comparing you to one. With your reference of Judge H being a "big bag of sh*t," as my Kindergarten classes used to say:"It takes one to know one."

Honey, you are just a lothsome bag of wind.

Also, sorry that Kenny turned you down. Things DO get around!!!

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Sunday, June 29 2003, 22:59 pm EDT

'cuse, it's Showalter."

--posted by P.S. @ Sunday, June 29 2003, 23:01 pm EDT

Most of this discussion is pretty good except for Smith's endless diatribes about Indians, his family's diseases, and how unbelievably awesome and incredibly wealthy/successful/powerful/god-like/amazing he is.

--posted by sigh @ Monday, June 30 2003, 2:25 am EDT

sigh...

it's Douglas-Smith, get it right, or am I to presume you can't read, don't know how to spell, and had to look up datribes?

Have a litte respect when addressing us novella writing successful/godlike/amazing people.

And if you can't do that, get a life, and quit your whinning.

Short enough for ya?

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Monday, June 30 2003, 9:54 am EDT

Oh, shucky darn, almost forgot!

Your eyes wouldn't be green, would they, sigh?

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Monday, June 30 2003, 9:58 am EDT

Let me get this straight. Court documents state that Mirkin could have had a .25% higher GPA with the highest possible grades, or about .0116 added to his GPA. An A+ vs. A grade would yield .33/33 = .01(assuming all of Blair's classes where 3 credits and her latin class was three credits -- 4 credits for language seems more to be the norm, which of course strengthens this point) additional points to Blair's GPA (assuming 33 total classes as above, as well) so that making the .055 GPA difference dependent solely on that, not to mention the 7 credits (assuming 1 credit/semester for gym) of gym, which assuming Blair received A's in would have separately yielded a GPA of 4.698(99/106) + 4(7/106) = 4.652, or rather a .046 lower GPA, almost the entirety of the gap between Mirkin and herself. In fact, if gym is two credits, we have a GPA of 4.698(99/113) + 4(14/113) = 4.612, actually below Mirkin's GPA. Simply with the doctored Latin grade and gym grade omission, Blair's GPA would easily have been below Mirkin's GPA. Note that so much as one case of a class where Blair would have received a .33 higher grade in a tutored class vs. school class along with the gym exception would push her GPA below Mirkin's as well, and it seems likely that one or more grades are present for several reasons including a closer tutor-student relationship, out of classroom pressures on the tutor, and quotes above indicating that some teachers for equivalent classes at the school do not give out A+ grades. I will await the rude and domineering responses.

--posted by John Morrow @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 2:19 am EDT

how long did it take you to write that without confusing yourself?

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 2:40 am EDT

Still waiting for a content based response...

--posted by John Morrow @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 3:27 am EDT

Well put.

--posted by glad i'm not from moorestown @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 9:19 am EDT

I have credits toward a PhD in math. What is John Morrow saying????? Since he is up all night (posting at 2::19 a.m.), what the dickens is he high on?

He is still waiting for a content based response....How do you make a "raspberry" sound on a computer?

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 11:05 am EDT

Mr. Morrow: Are you the individual who prepared Kadri numerous recalculations for the hearing before Judge Wolfson? If you are, you see from the following quotes from the decision that Judge Wolfson threw those calculations out of the window then and the rest of us are throwing your "poppycock" out of the window now. You say nothing.

Please refer to the following phrases:
"hypothetical curricula," "a faux transcript," "speculative calculations, theoretical curricula, and hypothetical alternative transcript" Perhaps you really are the inept sorcerer who prepared for Kadri.

--posted by Mr.. M. M. @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 11:25 am EDT

How about the terms theoretical student, or faux curricula. She's smart, but compare apples to apples and she is an average smart student. I doubt the fact that she is the smartest.

--posted by glad i'm not from moorestown @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 11:39 am EDT

Correction - not an average smart student, she is a highly above average student and that shouldn't be taken away from her. However, I still think that the Saludatorian should have been at least co-valedictorian.

P.S. Why can't blair take gym class?

In June 2001, Blair was given the Congressional Award Gold Medal. To qualify for this honor, students must complete and document 400 hours of voluntary public service, 200 hours of personal development, 200 hours of physical fitness, and a 4-day exploration. Kelly Fanning, from the Congressional Awards office, says, "For her physical fitness she did jogging, power-walking, and dance." Moorestown High School students, it should be noted, take roughly 75 hours of Phys. Ed. class per year.

see link

--posted by glad i'm not from moorestown @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 11:47 am EDT

Fraud-
A deception deliberately practiced in order to secure unfair or unlawful gain.
A piece of trickery; a trick.

One that defrauds; a cheat.
One who assumes a false pose; an impostor.

--posted by same @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 11:51 am EDT

So long as basic algebra is one of your credits towards a PhD, you can understand my above argument, so the rather weak appeal to authority is naysaying rather than tackling the argument's content. I wasn't aware that all people awake at 1:00 am are high on drugs, nor that S. Douglas-Smith is therefore a habitual user, but I see now that it only makes sense.

--posted by John Morrow @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 11:54 am EDT

After reading about this on the internet for weeks, I have some thoughts: 1)The Hornstein's gamed the gradeing system shamelessly (re-taking Latin, droping History when receiving an A-); 2) Kenny and the other kids played "fair" while Blair got every advantage due to the mystery disability. Didn't she even get additonal time to take the SAT?; 3) Like many people today, the Hornstein's chose litigation to force the course of events to go their way, claiming ridiculous and unwarranted "damages" both as a tool of intimidation and a potential jackpot. But, it seems to me, since she was named valedictorian which was her goal then they should have dropped the suit rather than going for the cash. and 4) In a few years, everyone will forget this and all the other kids will move on and have the lives they make for themselves. Will Blair always need her parents, special treatment and litigation to make her way in the world?

--posted by Amused from Afar @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 12:11 pm EDT

Blair will do just fine at Harvard, daddy will be an adjunct there. I bet Harvard can't find a big enough boot to kick themselves in the ass with. Can you imagine the legal battle that would take place if they actually did rescind her admission?

p.s. name change

--posted by glad my parents aren't from moorestown @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 12:35 pm EDT

Mr. Douglass-Smith is not living on the east coast.

John Morrow, Your argument is attempting to use BS to get into the fray of things. MS. HORNSTINE WON THE VALEDICTORY ROLE BY STRAIGHT, NORMAL CALCULATIONS, the one that the school followed for many, many years. No one needed to introduce new calculations except persons attempting to defend Mr. Mirkin, the school board, the lawyers, or Mr. Kadri, who were circling the wagons in their DEFEAT, OR CHEAT AND/OR DEFRAUD Ms. Hornstine. I am sure you area one of those persons. One and One will always be TWO. In your case, I am sure you will want to show that one and one is either 1.99999999 or ELEVEN.

I don't believe that the definition of FRAUD was an answer to your post but it should be. You are attempting to confuse the issue, i.e. "a piece of trickery," "deliberate deception," and "an imposter." Face it, the truth is Ms. Hornstine won, fairly, squarely and hopefully, YOU LIVE in Moorestown and will have to pay. YOU JUST CAN'T TAKE IT. GET OVER IT!

I repeat....ARE YOU THE INEPT SORCERER WHO CALCULATED FOR KADRI IN THE FIRST PLACE.....YOU LOSE! IF YOU ARE ON A WITCH HUNT....YOU LOSE! IF YOU WORK FOR THE MIRKINS, KADRI, MOORESTOWN BOARD OF EDUCATION, OR DR. MONA SHANGOLD (THE CRYING MIRKIN MOM).....YOU ARE A LOSER!!! Put that in your pipe and smoke it! The end.

--posted by Mr. M @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 12:50 pm EDT

Nope
Actually I'm from Bristol, Connecticut. Thats besides the point. Oh, sure she "won" by following all of the rules right? YOU are confusing the issue. What I meant by "a piece of trickery," is that she is OBVIOUSLY not affected by a disabily to the point where she needs to be given special treatment. The school board should review the validity of her disability all together. When a person says that they were injured at work and is disabled because of it, insurance companies spend millions of dollars making sure that the person is really disabled. They even hire detectives to follow the person around and maybe catch them performing 200 hours of physical fitness. When that person is caught, they are arrested for fraud and sent to jail.

The ADA is there to protect people with a disability. It is not a vehicle for an able person to use for personal gain.

That is fraud.

Put that in YOUR pipe and smoke it.

Now to my other point -

You really remind me of someone I know. To make a point, you are forced to attack those who disagree with you personally. You are probably a very smart person and should know that when one's only response to another is to use the word "Sorcerer" and call someone a loser we all know it's because they really have nothing substantial to say. So, I have been taught to say nothing at all. You can use as much prose as your vocabulary and grammar can spit, but in the end you sound like a child. Please don't attack people without being provoked. It's rude. None of my Grandparents went to college. Neither of my Parents went to college. None of my Siblings went to college. None of my many Aunts and Uncles went to college. I have been working full time since graduating high school, graduated college in 8 straight semester while doing so, and am now working on my MBA. I really don't consider myself a loser. I am just an outside person who smells a rat and his daughter.

--posted by glad my parents aren't from moorestown @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 13:20 pm EDT

When I wanted to take an independent study at MHS, I had to go around asking teachers to be my advisor. They all said no. Did Blair have to deal with scheduling conflicts? I only took Latin 1 once, and I got an A+. Why should my A+ count the same as one which was earned the second time around.

Finally, if Blair didn't take her classes in the school building, then she should be ineligible to be valedictorian. Now someone from Haddonfield will want to be val at Moorestown...

--posted by cretin @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 13:25 pm EDT

NOW IT'S MY TURN.
To glad...Please let me know when a student can "select" what he/she wants to do in PE in day.What awards did you ever win????

To Amused: So glad this is funny to you. 1) Hornstine is the correct spelling; grading is also spelled incorrectly.You read that Ms. H retook Latin, you read that in an article....is that article correct or surmised or is it a "legal" thing to do in MHS? Was it the same Latin or maybe Latin II, etc? Get your facts straight before repeating them. Gossip and inaccuracies only add to the confusion. An A- in history would have INCREASED her GPA. She changed the course from AP HISTORY to HONORS HISTORY because the additional work was interfering with her health (not the mark). How many Honors and AP courses did you take? See Judge's opinion below.
2) If Kenny played fair, why did his Mom go to school to cry foul, HIRE A LAWYER and join the suit also? He took ADDITIONAL AP COURSES (more than MS. H) to improve his GPA, but didn't score as well. She just scored better. He is a smart kid, too, but not quite as good when it came to school marks. I repeat, if she hadn't switched from AP History to the Honors course, her GPA would have been greater.
Her illness is no mystery. Well, I take that back...most illnesses are a mystery...where did they start? How come some get it and others don't when exposed to similar elements? The do call it the PRACTICE of Medicine. Ms. H is not mysterious, neither is her illness. Just because YOU don't know all the details, don't assume. Please read the following direct comments from the court case and Judge's ruling with reference to her health and the "history course:"

"It is undisputed that plaintiff needed this accommodation because her health problems caused “substantial fatigue” which rendered her unable to “attend [and] participate through a full school day.” Certification On November 20, 2002, Kadri was present at a meeting with plaintiff, her IEP team, and her parents. Complaint at ¶ 9. Plaintiff's treating physician and the IEP team agreed that due to her medical condition at the time, a reduction in the number of her courses was necessary. Id. at ¶ 8. Yet Kadri ordered that the school physician review plaintiff's medical condition. Id. at ¶ 9. The school physician agreed that a “reduction in course load is medically appropriate due to her exhaustion and overextending herself this year.” Id. at Exhibit A. Kadri, however, refused to allow plaintiff to drop a class. She instead withdrew from AP European History and enrolled in Honors Contemporary U.S. History. See L. Hornstine Cert. at ¶ 2, and Kadri Cert. at Exhibit B. "

Please also understand that the school physicians as well as her personal ones agreed to this type of schooling for Ms. H. in HER FRESHMAN year. This was not something that the Hornstines' decided to do at the last minute to improve her lot, as you believe. If you do not understand any of what the Judge said above, please let me know. I will explain it to you. Furthermore, your information about her taking the SAT's is incorrect. MS. HORNSTINE TOOK THEM WITH EVERYONE ELSE, HAD NO BOOKS WITH HER, HAD NO TUTOR WITH HER AND RECEIVED N O E X T R A T I M E.

3)Please read the laws relating to the American Disabilities Act. You will note in there, that damages are appropriate if a disabled person is discriminated against. The only way to defend this discrimination is by litigation since the school did not want to stand by "their" (the school) rules. A jackpot, you say???? Ms. Hornstine won many, many scholarships. She didn't go into this to win more money. She does deserve to win money because of the discrimination at school, the libel (lies) she has faced and winning the court case. If you think that not being able to attend your own graduation because the school and police feared for her safety is winning a jackpot, your head needs some work. Her life revolved around academics, she was not the campus queen, the head cheerleader, etc.

Will Blair need special attention and her parents in the future? We all need "special attention" no matter what it is. No one wants to be just another social security number. Her parents? Don't you need yours? I am sure that she will not be a needy person when it comes to them, but she will enjoy their company, advise, and love. Don't you need that also?

After reading the posts from Amused and glad...I think it is they who need the BOOT in the rump!

--posted by Mrs. Moorestown Mom @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 13:51 pm EDT

Glad: I smell envy and jealousy in your writing.

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 13:59 pm EDT

Hey Creaptin, are you back again? I see that your spelling has improved, but your facts have not. And who said,( some newspaper writer? Any better than "YoU" being an authority? )that she took the same Latin course TWICE????? Get your facts corrects before your blab, blab, blab.

Many, many students take some form of schooling at home, for various amounts of time. Their schooling is approved, as was Ms. Hornstine's by the Moorestown school district, paid for by the Moorstown school district and selected (course and teacher) by the Moorestown school district. She also DOES take SOME schooling in the MHS school building with other members of her class. Miss H. is a full time resident of Moorestown, her parents own property there and they pay taxes there. Therefore, SHE IS A LEGAL STUDENT (now a graduate)OF MHS.

Creaptin, you must learn. Gossip and an A+ in Latin are not going to get you too far.

--posted by Mr. M @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 14:11 pm EDT

Everyone:

Please stay on topic and keep the personal attacks away from your comments.

Keep in mind that the prism of interpretation can lead to an opinion that is different from your own.

Endeavor to critique and debate the points and the facts, not the person providing them (however tempting it may be).

-adam

--posted by Adam @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 14:09 pm EDT

Adam, I understand where you are coming from even though I respectfully disagree with you. I believe that you feel that it is okay to call Ms. H, her family, etc. frauds, cheats, liars, rats, etc., because you don't support them, but when one refers to the post person, who writes these words, reference to them as losers,envious, etc. are personal attacks. What are they then when these words are used to describe the Hornstines?

--posted by Mr. M @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 14:24 pm EDT

Adam: For some reason, I just read your resume (quite impressive) and saw your picture(quite handsome). I also reread your opinion which had known.You felt that Blair should have followed the spirit of the law instead of the litigation of the law. I was wondering how you, in California, got so interested in this case that you were "ranting and raving" over it. Was it because of something in your life? Parents/Money? Did you lose out on something in school or in a scholarship? What instigated you to begin this project and take the position you took?

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 15:37 pm EDT

I should be inserted between which and had in second sentence.

--posted by Mrs. M. M. Correction @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 15:39 pm EDT

Mr. M and all:

We can debate about whether or not Kadri, the Hornstines, or the Mirkins are good, bad, or in-between because that's what this web page is about. Quite frankly, we know more about these individuals because there is a larger body of information available, some gleaned from news sources and some revealed on the part of the commentors.

Thus, based on the information available, people who come to this web site (and read all the other relevant info on the Internet) can form their own opinion about Blair, Kenneth, or Mr. Kadri. Yes, I concede the point that *some* of the information is not correct (Mrs. MM and others have been quick to point out *certain* things that are clearly baseless). Some of the information, however, is incomplete and/or open to interpretation.

As I mentioned in my previous comment, differing interpretations can lead to different opinions and conclusions. That's fine and good for debate.

Let me make some things clear about my opinion:

1. Blair had a *legal* case to be named the sole valedictorian. From a legal standpoint, I agree that Blair should be the sole valedictorian. In my personal opinion, however, I think there could have been and should have been multiple valedictorians.

2. I believe that Kadri wanted to name co-valedictorians, including Blair and Kenneth.

I know what Mrs. MM has stated in the comments section about Kadri wanting to name only Kenneth as valedictorian. Quite simply, I don't believe that assumption. There is *no* indisputable fact that says Kadri was to have named Kenneth as the sole valedictorian.

3. For all intents and purposes, Blair went to a different school from all the other "regular" students at MHS. I feel that her curriculum was tailored so much to accomodate her that she was in a school of one. *Legally* she went to the same school, but realistically, she didn't. This is my opinion, one that can change, but it is my opinion. It might not hold up in a court of law, but it certainly does in a court of opinion.

4. Blair plagiarized in her newspaper articles for the Courier-Post. This may have no bearing on her academic record, but it does have bearing on her personal record.

I'm willing to change my opinion on Blair. As it stands right now, however, my opinion of her, despite some points in her favor, is low.

Aside from S. Douglas-Smith, who has talked at length about his life and family history (and posted his web site URL), I know very little about the posters on this web site. If you want to know more about me, you are free to visit the rest of this web site for more details.

If you want to counter some of the points that I've made in my article/comments with attacks on my character, you're free to do so. Keep in mind though that how one posts is often a reflection of the type of person that they are. The more one posts, the more one reveals their true self.

-adam

--posted by Adam @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 15:41 pm EDT

Mrs. MM:

> Was it because of something in your life?

Sure, nearly everyone has gone to high school and can relate to this story.

> Parents/Money?

Nope, except for the fact that I think it's ridiculous to sue a school district for $2.5/2.7 million dollars to be named the sole valedictorian.

> Did you lose out on something in school or in a scholarship?

Not at all. I garnered plenty of awards which are now worth very little to me, 10 years after graduation.

> What instigated you to begin this project and take the position you took?

When I find something that piques my interest, I write about it and post it on the web for posterity. My position is based on the facts that I have gathered and synthesized.

-adam

--posted by Adam @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 15:54 pm EDT

Thanks Adam for your response. I wish I could offer you more proof in this public setting on Item #2. I cannot convince you by the Judge's take or my knowledge that Kadri only wanted one Valedictorian , well maybe he would have increased it to two, but in no shape or form was any Valedictory role going to be given to Blair L. Hornstine. I do feel that the letter he wrote to Kenny was not disputable. Only Kenny received the letter. I do know and believe that Blair would have accepted a co-valedictorian role, which I believe would have settled this matter and would have been a proper solution to this "problem."

As far as a "different school"...I assume that even though she went part time to the school building and was given the identical courses of other students, graded often by the identical teachers, took the identical tests, you would not accept the same school theory. If she had been sick for say, a year, and then returned full time to the "building", would you then believe that she had the "same" schooling? Just musing...

Plagiarism? No defense except to say that no other works of hers, when gone over with a fine tooth comb, bore any marks of plagiarism. I give her the benefit of the doubt backed up by a wonderful and honest teacher, Mrs. Bettencourt,and accept her explanation.

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 16:25 pm EDT

Adam,

I would point out that I only fill in the blanks in your comment form, and your form itself posts my url as a link on my name. I don't do that, and even told Harvard that this forum was not about my website.

I draw from personal experience on how I address things. If that offends somebody, well, I'm not going to apologize.

Finally, there are lots of valid points for and against Blair, but regardless, the issue is based on school work, and it's merit, and not the personal actions of Blair Hornstine. In other words, out of school, doesn't add into the debate on the right or wrong of her being a validictorian.

I will strive not to bring my "personal" self into this debate, however, regardless of all of that, the fact is that I have never attacked, nor will I. Harvard 04 put it best, I "poked fun" at some of his comments.

To the individual who thinks I'm on drugs, not in this life, buddy. I won't take em when the doctor orders them, unless I have no choice. It's a personal thing, and frankly, in jest or otherwise, such a statement is not only pointless, it smacks of personal insecurity of the highest order.

I'm not a mathamatician, wouldn't want to be anyway, and however you figured out whatever it was you figured out is way beyond me. I just have to know how to count and subtract, I can do that, once you put the alphabet into the equation, I'm lost, and can't spell Alpha numeric without a dictionary. Thus I asked, how did you do that without confusing yourself, hey, sue me.

With that, onward I go.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 17:58 pm EDT

Dear Mrs. M.M. Thanks for the spelling tips! Your point #3 illustrates my argument about the lawsuit perfectly. Had they dropped the lawsuit once they achieved their stated goal of having Blair as the sole valedictorian, instead of going for the $ it might have ended there. Some kids/parents would have supported her and some the boy but she could have attended her graduation and experienced the rite of passage with the rest of the class. Accepting their win gracefully might have ended it but going for the money you say they don't need was vinegar to the wound. Otherwise you are right, I live thousands of miles away and only know what I read on the net so I am bound to get some details wrong.
Oh yes, one more question, are you Blair's Mom?

--posted by Amused from Afar @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 18:44 pm EDT

I just recently heard about the whole Blair Hornstine Debacle. I have finished reading through all the postings on this site and, frankly, I think the whole thing is sad and pathetic. A lot of people need to get over themselves. Sorry to disabuse you of your grandiose delusions, but having a four-point-whatever GPA, being Valedictorian vs. Saluditorian, or going to Hah-vahd is NOT, repeat, NOT evidence that you are an inherently superior life form. Also, I think the real whiney spoiled brats here are the parents. Not knowing any of the parties involved personally, I will nevertheless hazard a wild guess that both Blair and Kenneth desperately need a grown-up to tell them, "you know what, it sucks but sometime's life ain't fair. Rise above it." Instead they've got parents filing lawsuits and making stinks at school board meetings and writing letters to the editor and whatnot. Pathetic. You know, I had a close friend in high school who nearly became suicidal because he got an A- in AP English, ruining his chance to be Valedictorian. These days, he (or his parents) would probably sue, claiming that the teacher was incompetent or discriminatory or something. In any event, guess what happened to him? Went to a fine college, got a master's degree in Chemistry, and fifteen years later, he's got a nice wife and fine kids and he's reasonably happy and the fact that he didn't get to be Valedictorian doesn't mean squat. In my book, that's a successful human being.

--posted by Sarah @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 19:11 pm EDT

To S. Douglas-Smith:

I was refering to the rather childish drug comment made by Mrs. M & M, namely:
"Since he [John Morrow] is up all night (posting at 2::19 a.m.), what the dickens is he high on?" And though not entirely accurate as I am not on EST, from the timestamps on your postings, you too use your computer late at night, and according to Mrs. M & M's assertion, therefore clearly use drugs.

Your exact response to me was:

"how long did it take you to write that without confusing yourself?"

Sarcastically asserting that I was in error, which if I am will happily amend, or if anyone doesn't understand why this GPA calculation is relevant to the case at hand, I would happily explain in more detail why I think it is relevant.

However, I have not yet seen a single response challenging my assumptions or conclusions or approaching the issue in an adult and rational manner -- I put facts out for amendment and discussion, but have received only ad hominem attacks to discredit the content of my speech, as have many who have posted on this site.

--posted by John Morrow @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 20:29 pm EDT

S. D-S: I did not accuse you of being on drugs. I asked "the Mathematician", who happened to write all his gobblygook in the wee hours(because he is on the East Coast), if he was the one on drugs. I knew you were out west, so the "wee hours" posted were EDT not Mountain or Pacific time. Sorry, if you took think I referred to you.

My dear Amused: I thank you so much for the complimentry question. I AM NOT BLAIR'S MOM, I REPEAT, I AM NOT BLAIR'S MOM. Your thinking about dropping the lawsuit once Blair won her case is reasonable. The suit WAS, again I repeat, WAS going to be dropped until the neighborhood became such an unholy place to be. The students in the community, then their parents and neighbors supported the popular, cute boy. Blair was not Miss Popularity. She was the bookworm, the one who always had her head in a book, the one whose education was more important than her social life or wardrobe. The unreasonable,rude and crude treatment on Mrs. Hornstine, the threatening phone calls and letters(one classmate threatened in a public meeting to 'wring her neck' if she showed up for graduation'), the egging, spray painting, etc. of the home, the lies passed around, the obscene calls and e mails her brother received, the libelous unsupported statements that the Superintendent made and disputed by his Assistant,the despicable treatment Blair received EVERY day in school, the police cars needed outside the home to protect them (need I continue), I am sure paved the way for the suit to continue. IN ADDITION, DUE TO THE FACT THAT THE SUPERINTENDENT WAS ON THE HOOK FOR THIS, THE BOARD MADE FINANCIAL OFFERS TO SETTLE THIS CASE, SO THEY, INDIVIDUALLY AND KADRI, PERSONALLY, CAN NOT BE FURTHER SUED and their legal fees contained. The Board of Education wants to be re-elected,the Superintendent wants to remain, and they (the BOE)feel if they can settle this claim for less money, they will come out smelling like roses in the eyes of the community. If she wins anywhere near the $2.? million,you and I will eat our diplomas.

Ms. Hornstine is a fine, smart and lovely young woman. It isn't her fault that she is disabled. Because she is not physicially crippled or mentally challenged, "some" people believe she is not disabled.If her course of medical treatment were made public, possibly people would understand. Then again, if you don't want to believe she is disabled, you just won't. It is Blair's right for privacy. Publishing additional facts on her illness might get her more support in the court of public opinion, but, as is her right, she chooses to remain private. I am sure that she would have won the Valedictorian role, hands down, as a regular student probably with a higher GPA. I feel that even if she were a "regular student," this entire mess could still have been brought to bear since she was not the "popular" kid in the class and others had top grades. This class of 250+ is extremely bright: 3 are going to Harvard; one or more to just about every other Ivy; and many, many are going to top universities.It is almost unbelievable for a public high school of this size.There is a private and quality private school in Moorestown - Moorestown Friends. I bet that there senior class did not do as well as the public school class did. We are certainly proud of our school, its students and teachers. Now about the new Superintendent and BOE....

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 20:45 pm EDT

John Morrow: I will tell you in a brief statement or two why your calculations are not relevant:

The Moorestown High School Handbook specifies
that the Valedictorian is selected at the
beginning of the seventh (7) semester of the
student's matriculation by the normal calcu-
lations that have been used over and over
for many years. An A gets so many points, An
A in am Honors Class is worth so much and an
A in an AP course is worth so much....

Your formula could be selected at the beginning of the school year 2003 for the incoming Freshmen. The Judge ruled that the formula/calculations could not be changed mid stream for a student who spent four years at MHS. New rules/new calculations have to begin with an incoming Freshman class.

Therefore, it does not matter how you calculate whatever, it is not acceptable for the graduating classes of 2003, 2004 and 2005.

--posted by Mrs. M.M. @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 20:56 pm EDT

Responses:

To glad...Please let me know when a student can "select" what he/she wants to do in PE in A day.
- In my town, students are allowed to choose between three activities in PE so that this type of problem is avoided.

What awards did you ever win????
- The awards that I won were for my own actions. Not those of my father. see my link.

After reading the posts from Amused and glad...I think it is they who need the BOOT in the rump!
- An example of having nothing substantial to say, because you said nothing about my argument.

Glad: I smell envy and jealousy in your writing.
- I am in no way, shape or form jealous of anyone involved. In fact, I wouldn't trade my life for their/your lives ever. Nothing I stated points to that.

.....she took the same Latin course TWICE????? Get your facts corrects before your blab, blab, blab.
- From this source, Cretin is correct. see link

The fact of the matter is, I have a valid point. I think that the whole argument of her being disabled in the first place is flawed. If she was, how was she able to complete the 200 hour requirement for the Congressional Award Gold Medal? I think that this raises a red flag. Please, instead of insulting me, could you answer these questions for me?

1) Did the Hornstine family claim that Blair was unable to take part in gym class because of her "disability"? Yes or NO?

2) Meanwhile, did she complete the requirement for the physical fitness portion of the Congressional Award Gold Medal Award? Yes or No?

3) Does Mr. Hornstine do her charity work for her? Yes or No?

4) Does Blair have a firm understanding of the word PLAGIARISM and what happens when you are guilty of it? Yes or No?

All I know is what I read. If these are untrue statements from the article in the link below, than let me know and I will take back what I say and change my thoughts of this whole situation. If these statements are true, than I think that Blair has a problem with integrity and her resume probably severly overstates her. Her resume should say "Blair and Judge Hornstine" at the top. I am not trying to attack anyone personally other than the Hornstines. I think that what they have done since her freshman year is wrong if these statements are correct. But until I hear otherwise, I have my opinion.

Mrs. MM, Please stop attacking people. It makes you look rediculously foolish and it detracts from what you are trying to say. I like hearing what you have to say because there is a lot of truth and morality to it. I just wish you could refrain from the proofreading of others' material and give us just your real argument. If you have the answers to my questions, please respond. If you can't answer my questions than I understand.

Mr M and Mrs MM, are you Blair's parents or relatives? You said that you weren't earlier, but that you admired them Mrs MM, but I get this feeling that you wouldn't fight so viciously for them if you weren't in fact them.

--posted by glad my parents aren't from moorestown @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 21:09 pm EDT

John Morrow:

Sarcastically asserting that I was in error, which if I am will happily amend, or if anyone doesn't understand why this GPA calculation is relevant to the case at hand, I would happily explain in more detail why I think it is relevant.

I wasn's sarcastically asserting anything, that was a valid question. How did you write all that without confusing yourself, because I have no clue what you said. If you think that was sarcasm, you have a narrow view of what sarcasm is.

As for the drug comments... you know, it's just not worth it. I use my computer pretty much 24/7, it is, after all, what I do. Being nearly west coast makes my postings at Midnight, actually 10pm, but who cares, I simply jump in when I jump in. I don't do drugs... I learned to just say no.

As for the content answers, here. As has been established, the guidlines used for determining the Validictorian in this case do not include theoretical mathamatics, they're pretty straight forward. Regardless of why you disagree, under the format established for the class of 2003 in Moorestown, it was possible for Mr. Mirkin to get a higher GPA, and it was accepted that Blair repeated or retook a class, (Latin), by the school board, and the subsequent grade was used in computing her GPA. Because of this, all the hypothetical math, all the possible combinations, and all the whys don't matter, under the system used, Blair was the Valadictorian. As of 2006 a system more like the one you described will be in place, but until then, the way it is, is the way it is.

Now, having said all that, I'll say this. The plagiarism thing. For about the umpteenth time, regardless of whether she did or didn't, because it was not school work, it doesn't matter. Additionally, the editorial staff at the paper had a duty to review her submissions for content, and failed to do so. Even if she submitted something that was word for word out of a book, the simple fact of the matter is that the paper failed to properly edit her offerings. Though I have said she has a measure of responsibility, so does the paper, and as long as people ignore the secondary responsibility of the newspaper editorial staff, the plagiarism argument will remain flawed.

Ultimately, all of our brow beating is speculative reasoning. Certain facts remain. There is a finding of discriminatory intent by the school board, and it is, to me in any event, clear that Mr. Kadri had no intention of allowing Blair to be named valadictorian. The argument that she was primarially home schooled is flawed because home schooled people do not follow local school board approved IEPs. The fact that Blair studied under a board established, approved, and administered IEP makes her eligible for any award that any student can recieve.

The Presidential Gold Award. Over what period of time must one complete the activities? Is it one year, or is it cumulative. If it's cumulative, it could simply be that she did her physical requirements over the course of several years. As I'm not familiar with it, I don't know.

Finally, what has been done has been done. I expect it will continue to stir controversy long after we abandon this blog. The fact that there is mutual dissapointment for all the parties involved can not be salved by a monetary award, but ultimately, our system will only provied monetary awards, and that's the only thing with which we, the citizens, have to compensate those we wrongfully punish, attack, or discriminate against.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 22:19 pm EDT

whoops, provide, not provied... sheesh, I'm dangerous without drugs....

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 22:22 pm EDT

Again, Glad, let me clarify for the last time: I am not Blair Hornstine, her Mother, her Father, her Brother, etc. I thank you for the compliment, as I think they are a great family.

I will try my best to answer your questions.

1. Ms. H. could have probably taken PE if the actual sport/program would not have exceeded her tolerance and if the course were given at the times she was in attendance at the school. Miss H. could not take extreme physical activity (or too much of anything at one time) that effected her fatigue, energy or physcial appearance which are examples of problems she exhibits. The amount of time that she spends in school daily could not be exceeded because her symptoms appear, and she suffers. (Don't give me everyone is tired in school or after P.E. You know what I mean). Believe me, you would not want to be seen on a bad day either. All I can say...

As a substitute for PE, which I have stated here over and over, she had to prepare a 16 page paper for grading. She received a mark and the usual PE credits, like everyone else.

2. I believe there is no short time frame to accomplish the physical fitness portion of the Award. For instance, she may have had cumulative activities over a period of time. Furthermore, I would bet, although I am sure it did not happen with Blair, that because of the ADA law, physicial fitness could be waived.

3.Judge Hornstine's participation in Blair's charity work comprised of making a couple calls to organizers to ask when Blair/company were to be at an activity or to tell when Blair/company would be at such activity.(usual parent's things for most) For example, take an activity like Habitat for Humanity. Perhaps, the volunteer coordinator was only available at a time when Blair was in school or being schooled.

His courthouse was also in the area where clothing had to be dropped off for the underpriviledged. Blair does not drive. Would it be a crime, if he dropped the items off on his way to work? Mrs. Hornstine on an occasion or two picked up prom gowns for Blair's M.A.G.I.C. organization from the donators when their time frame differed from Blair's. Many more times than not, Blair accompanied her Mother on those runs.Blair did all of the soliciting, although many heard about the project and called Blair. (Gee, maybe her Mother took the message because Blair was not home.) Again, Blair does not drive. Told you she was a student.

4. Blair understands the word Plagiarism, I am positive. If you listen to her comments on the stories or believe the respected teacher from MHS who recently retired after 20 plus years and was her advisor, you would give Blair the benefit of the doubt when it came to the newspaper articles.

The Plagarism in the Courier Post was "found" by a relative of the Moorestown School Board Lawyer. This lawyer was so inept at the judicial hearing that people in the gallery laughed at him. For instance, (and you can read all of this in the transcript), Mr. Comegno cited a "case law" in defense of the school. Judge Wolfson knew the case well and said IT SUPPORTED THE PLAINTIFF (Miss H). He had his apples and oranges so mixed up. Poor lawyer. He made his role into a comedy act.

FURTHER AND MOST IMPORTANT- Blair's school work, award responses, etc. were gone over by the school, the award administrators, etc. with a fine tooth comb (as I have said over and over). Her work on these projects were found to be 100 percent HER work. Her newspaper articles were in no way part of her school assignments, award papers and so on. The news articles played NO PART in her selection or rejection of the class Valedictorian.

Note: I fight for her because she has "gotten the rotten end of the stick." She earned her spot as Valedictorian. If she had been an attending student, I have all the faith that her GPA would have been much greater. (After all, her brother was a Valedictorian and graduated from Harvard - this isn't a "dumb" family) I have seen what has transpired in our school and community. I have seen over many years that book worms are not as respected as "popular" kids. I have seen that "trashy" students are more respected that studious ones. I have told others above that this young lady was not interested in boys, clothes, proms, etc. She didn't even drive....a coming of age and importance for most students.

I hope that I have answered your questions. I did the best I could. I do speak with 99% accuracy. I am not Mrs. H., etc. I know that she is the harmed student.

P.S For many of you...there is a story at the University of Pennsylvania from many years ago. An architectural student submitted his class project for graduation. The professor told him that it could not be built and failed him. The student became a very successful architect many years later (you know what is coming)built and donated the "failed" building to the U of P. It still stands today. It is used constantly.

The above scenerio is my wish in some way for Blair. I hope that MHS will become Blair High School many years from now. (Comments, not accepted.)

--posted by mrs. m.m. @ Tuesday, July 1 2003, 22:40 pm EDT

Mrs. MM do you really believe that it came down to popular boy vs. bookworm?

And DOUGLAS-SMITH: I am sorry about typing your name incorrectly, (but to nitpick, YOU misspelled diAtribes while insulting my abilities).

"Have a litte respect when addressing us novella writing successful/godlike/amazing people."

--posted by sigh @ Wednesday, July 2 2003, 1:58 am EDT

Sigh: I don't really believe it came down to popular vs. bookworm. I KNOW that it was a vey important appurtenant factor.

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Wednesday, July 2 2003, 10:20 am EDT

Mrs. M.M. - You seem the most knowledgable so maybe you can answer a couple of questions - why, if as you say, people would be more sympathetic to her illness if the details were known is the family keeping it quiet. If it is more than the chronic fatigue syndrome usually stated why not just say so and garner more support? People aren't shunned for illness as in times past. Also, it seems contradictory to claim an illness for individualized treatment within the system and then claim a right to privacy regarding that illness. Won't details come out in any court proceedings anyway? My 2nd thought is that, this seems like a small-ish town and Mr. Hornstine is a judge...what kind? Criminal, family, traffic? Were I in any way connected to the school board or a graduating senior's family, etc. I'd ask for a change in venue if I ever found myself assigned to his courtroom! Just a thought.

--posted by Amused from Afar @ Wednesday, July 2 2003, 10:31 am EDT

Amused: I wrote a long, long answer to you and somehow I just lost it. I am attempting it again.

I believe that people would be more sympathetic to her illness if she had a more commmon condition, one where she could lose her life, or one that could be outwardly seen - a broken leg, wheel chair bound, etc.Her illness was never challenged by the board of education. The doctors for both the Hornstines and the school accepted her condition. This was never disputed in court. Why not publicize it, you ask? IT is personal. There is no reason to allow the public to further scrutinize her. It is private. There is no reason to allow her fellow students to criticize her, i.e. "four eyes," "nuts," "pegleg", etc., as students often do. Items of a personal nature are not for public consumption. Bowel habits, menstrual conditions, etc. are not displayed in a public forum.

""

Illnesses and marks are covered by The right of Privacy. Part of the legal suit discussed this right. The school (or Kadri, himself) devulged her marks to others. Her legal rights under the Family Act for Rights of Privacy were abandoned by the school with regards to the marks. As the school accepted her illness, there was no reason for it be brought out in the hearing.

Judge Hornstine is a criminal judge in a neighboring county. It would seem remote that school board member or a classmate would be brought up on charges before him. Although it has previously happened, crimes of that nature are rare in this small,tony community.

Why am I so supportive of Miss H? I believe the community wants "another" to get a chance. Blair and her brother were both valedictorians at MHS. They both received many scholarships and awards. Their parents, as are lots of others,are active participants in their children's lives. It is my belief that many in the community say "enough is enough" when it comes to the Hornstine children. Don't forget there are lots of smart kids in this town - three alone are going to Harvard out of 257. It is unfortunate that Blair is the younger of the two and suffers because of her birth placement. Jealousy, you say????

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Wednesday, July 2 2003, 12:12 pm EDT

A clarification for Mrs. MM

Judge Hornstine is now hearing cases in Family Court in Camden County. Judges in New Jersey (and perhaps elsewhere)rotate their assignments. He has heard civil matters in the past and perhaps criminal but I am not sure about this. Also, earlier Mrs. MM said that one is entitled to damages under the Americans With Disabilities Act (ADA). Since Adam encourages all of us to make this bog informational and not full of personal attacks, I wish to comment on this apsect. The availability of damages under the ADA depends on what part of the Act one sues under. I don't think compensatory or punitive damages would be available under the ADA to the Hornstines but there are several other federal laws and a New Jersey statute that might allow compensatory and punitive damages. Much depends on where they bring the suit and I have found conflicting information on this. Some newspaper articles said the Hornstines were suing in state court but the Last article in the Weekly Standard made a different cliam. The damages aspect of this case is quite complicated but interesting. Wish I knew more about this aspect but there is a great deal of statutory and case law on discrimination of all kinds and a growing body on disabilities.
Thank you Adam for encouraging civility.

--posted by DM @ Wednesday, July 2 2003, 12:52 pm EDT

Mrs. M.M. - Thank you for the clarifications although sometimes you protest too much. I didn't mean the family should release every detail, certainly nothing pertaining to bowel habits or monthly cycles. Where did that come from? I meant something simple like a medical name for an illness rather than the vague fatigue syndrome, that's about it. Why doesn't she drive?
I'm sure Blair, her brother and probably her parents are bright, accomplished people. Nevertheless, they sure seemed to rub alot of people the wrong way.

--posted by Amused from Afar @ Wednesday, July 2 2003, 13:37 pm EDT

sigh...

damn typos...

Still, have a little respect, besides, I didn't say I didn't have to look it up, did I?

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Wednesday, July 2 2003, 13:49 pm EDT

For DM,

The ADA is a Federal Statute, and any actions, suits, or claims brought under it's umbrella are heard in Federal Court. Some states have a version of the ADA which is more stringent, even than the ADA, and in those states it may be more prudent, or even more likely to present the case under state statutes as opposed to the Federal Statute.

New Jersey does not have an ADA statute, thus the case was presented and must be heard at the federal level.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Wednesday, July 2 2003, 13:55 pm EDT

Mrs. MM and all:

I removed your double post and fixed "enoough" to "enough".

To everyone: Don't worry about simple typos; everyone makes them and so as long as they don't alter the meaning of your post, I think people will understand (and hold back from such nitpicking)

Thanks.

-adam

--posted by Adam @ Wednesday, July 2 2003, 14:07 pm EDT

S.Douglas Smith

I know the ADA is a federal statute. But the parties may sue under the NJ Law Against Discrimination. Because both state and federal law protects against discrimination, where they may bring a damages claim may depend on both the law and its best application and whether and what limits apply to damages. The TRO was based on federal law and that is why it was heard in federal court. There is still a possibility they will choose a state court for a civil suit.

--posted by DM @ Wednesday, July 2 2003, 14:10 pm EDT

FYI

The damages part of this case is NOW under the direction of Federal Judge Freda Wolfson, the same Judge that heard the case. IF the damages portion is not settled, it will be heard by her in approximately and/or close to one year.

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Wednesday, July 2 2003, 16:23 pm EDT

Yes, Virginia there is a Santa Claus. Yes, Amused, they do rub some the wrong way. Chronic Fatigue Syndrome is the name of the "ailment" that the doctors have given her "condition." Anything further, I assume, would be tooooo detailed and invade her privacy. You felt that my analogy was not appropriate, but her "problems" are just as personal.

Drive, you ask???? Aha! Possibly, she is unable!?!?!?
Doesn't that seem strange to you that a young woman of 17 and 18 does not have a license to drive a car? Too much school? Too much charity work? Physicially unable? Chronic Fatigue Syndrom unable? Food for thought, huh?

I do protest too much? I just know many facts. I have been there. I was at the hearing. I am trying to sort of some untruths for many of you. I will never convince you and others that she is right. That is not my motive...dealing with the true facts is!

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Wednesday, July 2 2003, 16:34 pm EDT

DM and S. D-S: I do not know if the following will aid in your "argument", but I send it along anyway...

"Therein, plaintiff stated that:
Mr. Kadri and other members of the Board of Education . . . made a concerted effort . . . to violate the claimant's legal rights under the following federal and state statutes and constitutional provisions among others: Family Educational Rights and Privacy Act, Individuals with Disabilities in Education Act, Civil Rights Act . . . and the guarantees to procedural due process and equal protection of the laws of the Fourteenth Amendment to the United States Constitution. "

...from Judge Wolfson's opinion

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Wednesday, July 2 2003, 16:45 pm EDT

DM: Judge Hornstine originally was a Criminal Division Judge in Atlantic County, NJ. He had been a matrimonial and criminal lawyer. He possibly could have heard divorces in Family Court, but I am not sure. He came to Camden County, NJ about 9 years ago. He has been moved around several times, but I do not believe he ever heard civil. I will let you know by tomorrow. The last time I was informed, he was hearing criminal cases for juveniles.

As far as State or Federal for this case. It is beyond my scope. The only thing I positively do know is that this case was heard in Federal Court, and the Federal Judge is presiding, AT THE MOMENT, over anything else relating to this case. Tomorrow??? I pass on that debate.

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Wednesday, July 2 2003, 16:59 pm EDT

I think it is silly to have multiple valedictorians, especially when the top students do not have identical GPA's. Regardless of how she and her family were gaming the system, Miss Hornstine had the highest GPA and should have been declared valedictorian. Changing the rules, simply because it seemed "unfair" that she was given advantages that the other students were not, is another example of the outcome based culture we have made for ourselves. You don't just change the rules after the fact because you don't like the results.

That being said, I think the Hornstine's conduct has been pretty disgusting. Judge Hornstine's remark that he didn't want his children to be humiliated by having to "settle" for just being salutatorian, as he was, is just vile. I want the best for my kids too, but fighting your own battles through your kids is doing them no favors. Blair is going to be infamous at Harvard from the start as a result this, and they have no one to blame but themselves.

As for that weak excuse for the plagarism, I'm sorry, blaming the editors because they failed to catch her is absurd. It's pretty simple; you don't take someone else's words and try to pass them off as your own. She cut and pasted entire passages of other peoples work, you can't tell me that a valedictorian wouldn't know that was wrong.

--posted by Tom D @ Wednesday, July 2 2003, 17:51 pm EDT

Tom D: You are entitled to your opinion in your paragraphs one and three.

I respectfully disagree with your statements in paragraph two. That is why I get so involved with this blog. Please read the forthcoming paragraphs from Judge Wolfson's hearing, where the Assistant Superintentent who was attending the meeting with Judge H. and the Superintendent supported Judge H. and said that Judge H, in no way said anything about "his" being the salutatorian, settling, etc.

" Mr. Hornstine disputes most of Kadri's account of the meeting, stating, for example, that he was not salutatorian of his class, since his “class rank was never that high.” L. Hornstine Cert. at ¶ 19. Plaintiff offers the certification of Assistant Superintendent Judithann Keefe, who was also present at the meeting, in support of Mr. Hornstine's account. Certification of Judithann C. Keefe, Ed.D. (“Keefe Cert.”)."

Thank you

--posted by Mrs. M.M. @ Wednesday, July 2 2003, 18:10 pm EDT

Tom D.,

"...That being said, I think the Hornstine's conduct has been pretty disgusting. Judge Hornstine's remark that he didn't want his children to be humiliated by having to "settle" for just being salutatorian, as he was, is just vile. I want the best for my kids too, but fighting your own battles through your kids is doing them no favors. Blair is going to be infamous at Harvard from the start as a result this, and they have no one to blame but themselves.

As for that weak excuse for the plagarism, I'm sorry, blaming the editors because they failed to catch her is absurd. It's pretty simple; you don't take someone else's words and try to pass them off as your own. She cut and pasted entire passages of other peoples work, you can't tell me that a valedictorian wouldn't know that was wrong..."

Your post is a perfect example of people ignoring the obvious, in order to support something that does not merit that support when the facts are known. Mr. Hornstine simply did not say what Mr. Kadri claimed he said, and one of Mr. Kadri's own peers backed Mr. Hornstine on the matter. Mr. Hornstine was never ranked high enough to be salutorian, or even a "somewhat high up there in rankingatorian." He didn't say it, but you have created a picture in your mind based on that falsehood that colors your entire opinion of things. That being said, I think we can then safely say that he was not fighting his "own" battle through his kids, rather he was protecting his child from an unfair, and demonstratably hostile school official, (Mr. Kadri), through whatever means possible, and only when Mr. Kadri would not relent, and actually LIED about Mr. Hornstine, did Mr. Hornstine bring the suit. After all, it was initially the "fuzzy math" of Mr. Kadri that put Blair's accomplishment into question.

To the plagiarism part of your comment. No one has ever said that it was right, rather, that it didn't matter. It doesn't. It has no bearing on her schoolwork, and has no place in the debate about her being or not being the validictorian. To further that, regardless of what she did, the editorial staff of the paper has an ironclad obligation to it's readers to insure the accuracy of anything they print. After all you don't see Copyright 2002, Blair Hornstine on the paper's masthead, do you? An editor by definition, edits. By ignoring the obvious cutting, pasting, and paraphrasing in Blair's editorials, the papers editors not only embarrassed themselves, they created an environment of hostility that they share an equal responsibility in. Had the editors DONE THEIR JOBS and EDITED, Blair Hornstines editorials would never have seen the light of day, let alone print. It is not an excuse, it is a fact, and the fact that the editors did not do their job lent to an already hostile public an appearance of inpropriety that Blair did not create alone. All I'm saying is there is an equal measure of responsibility to that side of things, and it's time the paper accepted that.

I can tell you that regardless of who Blair Hornstine was, the paper's editors were aware of the controversy surrounding the validictory when they published her writings, and it seems to me, not impossible that the paper knowingly let her cut and paste jobs be published in order to fuel the fires in Moorestown regarding her position of Validictorian. That she may not have understood the full dynamic implication of a cut and paste job are speculative, but that the paper did not EDIT as it should have is factual. One goes to a mind set, the other goes to legal obligation, which the paper itself ignored in order to allow the controversy surrounding Blar Hornstine to fester even more, before, wonder of wonders, 'exposing' her writings for what they were. Isn't it interesting that the paper admits it did not apprise Blair of it's ethical requirements? Could it be that this paper wanted a puppy to kick? Seems like it to me.

Sadly, though, you fell for it. Personally, I hold editors and publishers to a higher standard, and I believe that they should share in the negativity that they ALLOWED their paper to create when Blair wrote her editorials. Since they knew, what they should have done is print it under a headline like this; "LOCAL VALIDICTORIAN SUBMITS STOLEN STATEMENTS AS HER OWN, READ THE DAMING TRUTH BELOW"

They didn't do that, and thus they, as well as Blair, are responsible for the mess. Two wrongs don't make a right Tom D., and I'm sure you don't want to teach your children otherwise.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Wednesday, July 2 2003, 18:58 pm EDT

Is it the responsibility of the editors of a newspaper to verify that every word, phrase and article submitted for publication is indeed those of the purported writer? If so, what a Herculean task it would be to scour online and offline sources - seeking to insure that all works are "original". Most daily newspapers' fact checking staffs would require days, if not weeks, to accomplish such. Editorial staffs implement ethics policies, placing the responsibility and requisite trust in their writers to abide by common sense and decency that they will submit original works. I disagree with the contention that the local newspaper should be held responsible for letting Blair's "plagiarized" words be published. Passing off the words of a former President and others (with a bit of tweaking and word smithing here-and-there) is simply unacceptable. As to the claim by some that the school may - or may not - have reviewed Blair's school work ... how many school systems retain the written works of their students? Don't most reports, etc. getting graded and handed back? Does Moorsetown photocopying...and or digitize all student submissions...so as to have an ongoing archive? I doubt it.

--posted by cambridgema @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 10:13 am EDT

So as not to get "flamed" - as seems common on this blog - for my typos ... let me correct myself above ... should be ; should be .

--posted by cambridgema @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 10:27 am EDT

So as not to get "flamed" - as seems common on this blog - for my typos ... let me correct myself above ... "getting graded" should be "get graded" ; "photocopying" should be "photocopy".

--posted by cambridgema @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 10:29 am EDT

Interesting point there, cambridema, I was wondering when someone was going to bring up the ETHICS POLICY.
The Courier Post violated it's own ethics policy by NOT providing Blair with a copy of said policy. In fact, although Blairs articles occured over the course of weeks, the Courier Post NEVER offered, provided her with, or exclaimed their ETHICS POLICY to her, and has admitted the same. In so doing, the Courier Post not only violated the self same Ethics Policy that they claim they operate under, but they denied Blair a basic tool in the journalistic repartie.

Because of the various actions of the staff of the Courier Post, the net result is that Blair was not made aware of the Ethics Policy, it was willfully withheld from her, and the editorial staff was remiss in not stopping publication of articles that they KNEW were partially plagiarized. It you want to split hairs, here's the split, by not providing Blair with their ethics policy, and by not policing their own paper, and by not striking, or notating each of her articles, the Courier Post, aware of the lawsuit, created a situation where her work outside of school was called into question. In so doing, not only did the paper fail to advise Blair in her writings, but it dropped the proverbial ball in not editing for content, the documents she submitted. In doing that the paper, and it's editorial staff appear to have been fostering an environment of hostility, and outrage, while seeking to deflect it's own responsiblity. Given the BLATENT nature of the items, it would not have been difficult or enven time consuming to have either documented the attributions, ro simply not published what Blair had to say.

Can we say conspiracy?

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 10:37 am EDT

Wow, you believe that last sentence? It should read: "..it would not have been difficult or EVEN time consuming to have either documented the attributions, OR simply not published what Blair had to say..."

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 10:41 am EDT

S. Douglas-Smith, so that I can better understand the situation... and in the spirit of seeking clarification and not in challenging your posting ... where can I find objective evidence of and support for your point that the Courier Post never provided Blair with an ethics policy; that the school system never provided their future Valedictorian with a lesson about plagiarism? And - in what way - and under which circumstances - should anyone be excused from plagiarism? I am sure that Blair now regrets her actions, but she can not rescind them.

BTW - I personally find it a stretch to think that there was a conspiracy at work.

--posted by cambridgema @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 10:53 am EDT

Upon further review … I continue to feel that it is a stretch to contend that the Courier Post conspired to discredit Blair by “allowing” her to plagiarize. The timeline of events seems to work against such a theory. (BTW – regardless of the situation, I still find it abhorrent for anyone to plagiarize other peoples’ works – and particularly on multiple occasions. There is no excuse for such).

It appears that Blair filed her lawsuit and thus brought the matter public in early May 2003.

Please refer to the first public mention of the lawsuit (which I could find):

May 3, 2003
“S.J. student sues to be sole valedictorian”
from the South Jersey News
http://www.southjerseynews.com/issues/may/m050303c.htm

The various writings which indicate plagiarism by Blair were all published BEFORE early May 2003.

October 26, 2002 – essay on Iraq
October 29, 2002 – story on religion in schools
November 12, 2002 – story on art censorship
November 26, 2002 – article on Thanksgiving
March 29, 2003 – essay on North Korean nuclear arms.

Please refer to:

June 2, 2003
Stories, Essays Lacked Attribution
From the Courier Post
http://www.courierpostonline.com/static/st060303g.html

A conspiracy theory just doesn’t jibe.

--posted by cambridgema @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 11:25 am EDT

Cambridgma,

Blair filed her suit after EIGHT months of negotiations, which the Courier Post was aware of, as one of it's employees is related, (and "exposed" the plagiarism suddenly) to the School Boards' Lead Council. As has been documented on this blog, by Adam, the Courier Post acknowleged that it did not provide Ms. Hornstine with a copy of it's Ethics Policy, (read the basis for this site, posted by Adam at the begining of this exchange, and follow the links to that information)

The Plagiarism in itself, is not grounds to deprive Ms. Hornstine of the Validictory because the stories and essays printed by the Courier Post were not school work, and in no way added to her GPA. This is why it was called a "NON ISSUE".

The Courier Post, regardless of your take on it, has an obligation under the 1st Amendment to make sure that protected speech, (quotes, ect.,) is not allowed to be published without proper attribution, which is why an editorial staff exists, and why an Ethics Policy exists. That they did not provide her with such, indicates that at some point, someone, (who knew that these stories existed well before the suit was filed), chose to ignore it until it became a matter in the courts.

It is interesting to me that the Courier Post waited until after the Temporary Restraining Order was issued to "publish" an expose about how horrible Ms. Hornstine is, and how she is a theif of words. I have said many times that I don't agree with plagiarism, and to make it clear, I don't, in any form, however, because of the nature of the action, the lack of editorial oversight by a staff well trained in such things, and the lack of any Ethics advice from the editorial staff of the Courier Post, it seems to me that the Courier Post either subjectively ignored the deed until it could "break the story" and sell more papers, or until it could do the most damage to Ms. Hornstine. Thus, a suggest a conspiracy of sorts.

Again, Ms. Hornstine was most certainly wrong, I don't dispute that, but the paper has a measure of responsibility that must be upheld. When it isn't you get reporters who "make up stories" ((another Blair comes to mind)) and you get the mass confusion of Hyped up reporting, the likes of which accompanied the Pfc. Lynch story. Not checking and validating information is the very reason that this country today is so suspect of the media. To credit the Courier Post with some kind of ethical credio that it did not excersise is to ignore the repeated examples of journalistic irresponsibility that have come to light in the last few months.

A reporter's job is to get it right. An editor's job is to make sure the reporter got it right. An editorial is no different, and the editors have an obligation under law, and under moral principle to justify their actions or lack of them in regards to Blair Hornstine, if for no other reason than because they did know, and did nothing; until it suited them, and until it garanteed an increase in sales. In and of itself, it demonstrates a profit driven agenda, and on the outside looking in it smacks of deceptive practices designed to besmirch Ms. Hornstine, and to ultimately increase their bottom line.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 11:43 am EDT

Earlier someone accused the Board's attorney of incompetence and now S. Douglas-Smith suggests he violated attorney-client confidentiality by discussing cases with relatives. Be careful. You are making some serious allegations and I question the basis for these views. ONe newspaper article stated that the Courier Post asks its young writers to sign a statement that the work they submit is their own. Moorestown schools discuss plagiarism early and often. After the law school, Ms. Hornstine became a public figure and unfortunately, open to public scrutiny. Her writings were public too. She copied. She cheated. There isn't much more one can say. If I leave my purse unattended in a public place and it is stolen, I have been careless but not more criminally culpable than the thief.

--posted by DM @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 12:03 pm EDT

S. Douglas-Smith: Thanks for the clarifications. I will take a look at Adam’s posts and seek to get a better understanding of the timeline. It will take some more self-convincing, though, for me to conclude that a community was involved in some sort of conspiracy.

My posts today are merely focused on the issue of Blair's plagiarism in her newspaper submissions... and I agree that such has no bearing on her claim to being Valedictorian and/or any related discrimination or wrongdoing related to her situation in Moorestown.

Regarding a newspaper's - or magazine's - duty to insure that plagiarism doesn't occur ... I disagree. It is impossible to expect that editors check every word and phrase submitted. In 18th. century America, how could editors in Philadelphia be sure that Benjamin Franklin's words were not being "lifted" from broadsheets printed in Boston? Where in First Amendment law is there precedent for holding editors responsible for the ethical transgressions of their writers? How do we account for the Jayson Blair's of New York Time's infamy ... and Stephen Glass of New Republic?

Let me take the liberty of extending your contention - is it Adam's duty/responsibility to insure that the words each of us are posting here are truly our own. Should he be held responsible (as the de facto “editor”) – ethically, morally, or legally – if I happen to be exposed as presenting the words of others as my own?

--posted by cambridgema @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 12:04 pm EDT

I mean, "After the law suit..."

--posted by DM @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 12:05 pm EDT

I realized that the plagarism accusation is unrelated to the valedictorian dispute. I have already stated that she deserves to be named valedictorian. Do you really believe that there was some vast conspiracy by the paper to entrap Miss Hornstine into submitting plagarised articles? Let's get out the tinfoil hats and call Oliver Stone. You don't need a published code of ethics to know that plagarism is wrong. As to what I teach my children, they know that taking credit for things they did not do is wrong. Using Clintonian excuses about not being told that she couldn't cheat, or that because there's no place for footnotes, it means you don't have to give credit for ideas not your own, just doesn't cut it.

You wonder why there is such animosity in their community? I don't doubt at all that there is some jealousy involved. But aside from the distaste over their lawsuit, I think clearly most of the problem has to do with all of the out of school projects that she somehow has the energy to do, while pleading fatigue when convenient. While she is certainly entitled to her privacy, it isn't hard to see why many in their community are skeptical.

--posted by Tom D @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 12:08 pm EDT

DM, whoa, I suggested no such thing. The alleged discoverer of the plagiarized articles is in fact related to the attorney for the school board, and if that person, (the relative) mentioned to the attorney, that such a thing existed, I fail to see where there is a violation of attorney client privlege. That it occured, (the information was passed on to the attorney) is not a violation of anything, it's a source of information that in no way devolves any private or confidential information to a third party. I am making a statement of opinion, based on my take on things, and the complete, and in my opinion, irresponsible actions of the editorial staff of the Courier Post. Maybe it's because I won't compromise on quality, or performance in my life that I take such a narrow view of the Courier Post editorial staff ignoring obvious and repeated references and statements made by others in Blairs essays. I believe strongly in self policing, and in being responsible for one's own actions. I have said repeatedly, and this is my position, Blairs actions in regards to the plagiarism are wrong, the editors actions in not editing the content is also wrong. Neither of these events, however, have any bearing on her class standing.

I don't know about you, but I expect people to be responsible for their actions. I don't believe that Blair has accepted fully, or repentantly, her responsibility in the plagiarism situation, nor do I applaud her for her "retraction, and explination". I do however, have even less respect for the paper, in that it has never at anytime accepted any measure of responsibility for it's lack of action in this situation.

At least Blair made an effort to explain her side of it, and I agree, it smacks of CYA, when in my opinion, she clearly understood what plagiarism was. However, and this is the bottom line, her actions, and her lack of proper attribution is not, was not, and will never be, justification for denying her the honor she earned, and was deprived of based on the hostility and very real threats of a community chastised because it tried to take away from her accomplishments in school.

Now, having said that, don't go accusing me of things I haven't done. That the information was "discovered" by a relative of the School Board Attorney is simply a statement. It certainly doesn't express that the attorney then exchanged information regarding the school board with his relative. Quite the reverse, the relative was providing the attorney with possible ammunition to assist him with his efforts against Ms. Hornstine, and in favor of the board. That isn't an ethical violation, it's developing evidence.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 12:21 pm EDT

Tom D.

No, I do not think there is a vast conspiracy within the community. I think that a few well placed people with an AGENDA will do anything to spoil, ruin, defame, ridicule, and injure a person when that group of people doesn't get their way. The community was clearly against Ms. Hornstine, and the rightful application of the rules to become the Valedictorian in the school system. When their efforts were thwarted, on principle, and in fact, they became violently aggressive, egging the house, making threats, painballing the house, openly ridiculing and threatening bodily harm to Ms. Hornstine. Their agenda was derailed, and they decided to rail against her.

Suddenly, though it had been months of such abuses, the plagiarism comes to light. Amazing to me that it took from October to June to discover this terrible offense. Is she wrong? Yes, of course! Should she be more repentant? In my opinion, absolutely! Does she deserve to be threatened with bodily harm, as one student suggested? Without question, no! Does she deserve to have her house damaged, and the family cars? NO, of course not! Are these actions, (threats, property damage, and intimidation) worse than plagiarism? Without question, yes!

Is the community, (a portion of it) responsible for these actions? YES! Do I see a possible connection to the release of the plagiarism story with the defeat of the School Board's attempt to deprive Blair of her rightful honor? Yes I do, because it's too convienient that it just suddenly came to light when it was obvious in October that she had done it. Like I said, I'm a skeptic when it comes to news orginizations in the first place. I don't trust any orginization with a political, profit motivated agenda that uses it's position of trust to influence public opinion in matters it espouses upon. Please don't tell me that newspapers don't have a political agenda, they do, otherwise they wouldn't endorse politicians in election season.

Finally, Tom, you're right you don't need a published code of ethics to know plagiarism is wrong, but at the same time you don't need editors if you're not going to edit. You don't need reporters with degrees if all you're going to publish is speculation without verification, and not verifying Blair's content is exactly the same thing as not verifying J. Blairs falsified stories, or using mysterious sources with no factual background to credit your speculations. I'll refer again to the Pfc. Lynch debacale. My point is simple, and it seems most are willing to be fed bullsh*t with a spoon because it falls under journalistic license. I disagree, it falls under responsible reporting, and that is a process that involves the reporter/writer, the editors, and ultimately the public. By excusing the lack of editorial supervision we excuse the publication of lies, halftruths, and outright slander, and simply put, with me, that won't fly.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 12:41 pm EDT

S. Douglas-Smith
You said the Courier Post was aware of the 8 months of negotiations between the Superintendant and the Hornstines because a relative of the Board's Counsel worked at the Courier Post. How did the paper know this? You draw the inference that relative was given this information by the attorney and this kind of sharing of confidential information regarding legal advice or a pending case violates legal ethics codes. I doubt you meant to suggest this and I thinkwe should not continue with this line of discussion because of its serious implications to some of the parties involved.

--posted by DM @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 12:43 pm EDT

>>Do I see a possible connection to the release of the plagiarism story with the defeat of the School Board's attempt to deprive Blair of her rightful honor?

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 12:48 pm EDT

>>Do I see a possible connection to the release of the plagiarism story with the defeat of the School Board's attempt to deprive Blair of her rightful honor?

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 12:49 pm EDT

Blair's plagiarism(s) were discovered because a reporter for the Courier Post was doing research for an article. He was going to write an article about Ms. Hornstine. He found some pieces she had written for his newspaper, and then he realized that they sounded "familiar."

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 12:49 pm EDT

There was no conspiracy to discredit Blair. She managed to do that pretty well to herself without any outside help.

Blair's actions should not be taken lightly. She stole others' words. While that may not be a big deal to you, it would have been enough to get her kicked out of any reputable university.

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 12:52 pm EDT

Accurate Information:

The school board attorney was a "buffoon" (sorry, Adam)at the hearing; he either was not prepared or was not sure which side he represented (see transcript of hearing.

Same attorney's aunt who did not have direct privilege to Blair's articles, "happened on" the plagarism from up to eight months prior. STALE NEWS. Normally "current" is what daily papers seek.

Plagarism is wrong.

Blair, having not received any policy or ethics information from the Courier Post did not understand how to credit "others'"words in a newspaper article.
(true, possibly unbelievable by many...no footnotes, etc. in newspaper. See papers of her well respected English Teacher)

Blair's newspaper advisor/editor NEVER reviewed her work.

The scrutiny of her work in the Courier Post developed "after" the winning of the lawsuit.

Her newspaper work had absolutely NOTHING to do with the school selection of Valedictorian - the lawsuit.

"Conveniently pleading fatigue" is a nasty statement made to discredit her or an unfair description of her illness.

In between her "medicating", the twelve or so waking hours was spent on school work, charity work, etc. I repeat, She does not drive, date, have much interest in clothes, etc. (typical 17-18 year old "girl stuff") She used to do some acting and play a musical instrument or two. That was all given up several years ago because of time constraints due to her illness.

Tom: In teaching your children right from wrong with respect to "taking credit," please add "false accusations" to the mix. "Conveniently pleading fatigue" is a gross mischaracterization in this case.

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 13:12 pm EDT

Cretin, apparently you can not read English. I said I do not approve in any way the plagiarism aspect of this now devolving thread. I did not say it was or was not a big deal, but in the overall, it is a lessor deal than threatening her with bodily harm, or destroying her families personal property. You have never seen me say Hey, lets ignore the plagiarism, nor have I voiced an opinion about her admittance to Harvard. You have seen me say it is not relevant to the issue of the law suit. It is not.

Blair's plagiarism(s) were discovered because a reporter for the Courier Post was doing research for an article. He was going to write an article about Ms. Hornstine. He found some pieces she had written for his newspaper, and then he realized that they sounded "familiar." And you are going to tell me that other, better educated people, and people in postitions of authority at the Courier Post did not recognize that, but this erstwhile reporter did? I can not for one minute believe that every one on the editorial staff was simply ignorant of this familiar sounding prose. Not only that, I can not imagine any self respecting editor not being at least familiar with such articles and in particular, the speech she lifted from Clinton. So, either the Courier Post employees a group of ignorant moronic twits to edit it's copy, orrrrrrrrr, somebody ignored the facts, orrrrrrrr, maybe, just maybe, somebody familiar with the situation said, hey, let's sit on this for a bit, and see how it plays out. If she wins, it's a bomb, and we make money, and if she loses, hey, it's just another stake in the heart. Now, of the three, given that I know newspapers want to increase their sales, I, being the skeptic I am, vote for the third possibility. I can be wrong, but it no less validates my opinion of things. As to a conspiracy, hey, it only takes two, and if the reporter was aware of it in April, and it wasn't published until June, my question then, is why did they wait TWO months, until after the TRO was issued, to report it?

Instead of attacking my position, which is based on an opinion, and principle that I hold myself to, why not address the questions I keep asking? Why not address the flaws in the presentation from the Courier Post, or the clear questions of timing? I, like I said, hold myself, and the entities I do business with, personally, or professionally, to a much higher standard, than apparently anyone on this blog, because I won't settle for mediocre, and I won't tolorate ineptitude. That's me, that's how I am, deal with it.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 13:20 pm EDT

Wrong again.

I have a friend who works at the Courier Post. Blair SIGNED a statement that she would only submit orginal work.

While Blair's ethics problems have nothing to do with the lawsuit, they do help us in making character judgments.

If I had doubts about Blair's character before this came to light, I certainly don't anymore. You can't defend plagiarism. Whether or not the Courier Post is to blame is irrelevant. Either Blair plagiarized or she didn't.

I don't believe in Blair's illness (which is so rare that it doesn't even have a name) any more than I believe that she didn't know plagiarism was wrong.

Blair wasn't discriminated against. She was discriminated in favor of. I would have liked to work at home, but I was never allowed the opportunity. I would have loved to write a paper instead of taking Phys Ed. I would have benefitted from dropping classes that I was doing poorly in, only to finish them at home and receive an A+.

Out of curiosity, how many other Moorestown students had access to Blair's tutors?

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 13:22 pm EDT

Creaptin: Again your facts are I N C O R R E C T. The "he" you refer to is a SHE. "SHE" was not a reporter.

Miss H's work for any newspaper not related to a university would not have qualified her to be thrown out of said university. A university polices itself. If she had plagiarized on a school assignment, she would definitely be shown the door. If she plagiarized in the university's newspaper, she would have been thrown off the staff. It would have been debatable if was asked to leave school.

--posted by Mrs. M.M. @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 13:24 pm EDT

Whether or not the Courier Post acted appropriately is IRRELEVANT. I think their editors f&cked up. It makes them look bad.

But BLAIR was the one who plagiarized. Unless someone else submitted plagiarized articles under her name (reverse plagiarism?? :-P ), there is no defense for Blair.

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 13:26 pm EDT

Mrs. M.M.

Ad hominem attacks are logically fallacious. Please rephrase your post in a logically valid manner.

Thank you.

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 13:27 pm EDT

DM,

The paper knew it because it was common knowledge that Kadri, in school meetings, with students, and in PUBLIC board meetings mentioned the "co-valedictorian" proposal because of what he claimed in these public meetings was an unfair advantage by a student. Blair objected to it from the outset, and the 8 months leading to the lawsuit were a matter of public record regarding the changing of the rules for the award of the valedictory. In other words, it was common knowledge.

You're so busy trying to put words in my mouth that you are overlooking the simple truth of my statement, it was "passed" to the attorney, it was not passed from the attorney. The debate about the Valedictory was long standing well before Blair finally sued. Otherwise, DM, please explain the community involvement well before the suit, expressing it's opinions, at board meetings, regarding the change of the rules to recalculate the valedictory award, or name co-valedictorians.

How did the paper know? Ummm, they attend school board meetings in order to report on them? I don't know, could be, but with the journalistic standards exhibited by the Courier Post, maybe they got the minutes by osmosis.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 13:32 pm EDT

http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/002/852lodkv.asp

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 13:39 pm EDT

Cretin,

Not only am I not wrong, as I am stating an opinion, I stand by it, even if you don't like it. I have not defended plagiarism, and I don't see, unless you can not read English, how you can get that I have. I simply will not excuse the Paper of it's obligation to EDIT it's content. If you can't understand that, then your second post about the paper looking bad is just more mushrooms in a spoon. You are trying very hard to put words in my posts that are not there. Stick to what I said, I generally do a pretty good job of saying exactly what I think, and what I think, while it is my opinon, is not subject to interpertation, because I clearly state it is my opinion. Get your own opinion, and present it.

As to the disease being so rare, (I know I'm gonna hear about life experiences and how I go on and on now), I had an uncle who died of an ailment simular to ALS, but not ALS. It didn't have a name either, but it killed him just the same. Near as I can figure they ended up calling it Cranial Endomatic Milogia, and that could be wrong too. What is right is that since 1905 there have been exactly 5 documented cases of it, and it killed everyone of it's victims.

Just because it's rare doesn't mean it doesn't exist, and just because you think it's a lazy issue, doesn't mean it is. Chronic Fatique Syndrome is recognized by insurance companies as a valid illness, and it was recognized by the school board as a legitimate disability. As much as you'd like to excuse all the behaviors of the town, and all the threats attacks, and damages done by townsfolk against and to the Hornstines, the simple fact is that 1.) She was entitled to the award, the honor, and the once in a lifetime chance to be the best of something. 2.) Even though it lost, the town still won, because through it's actions it made the outcome the same as if it had won, by threat, intimidation, and harrassment, Blair Hornstine was deprived of her rightful place at the head of her class. 3.) Regardless of what Blair did, it did not warrant the juvinile and repugnant behavior of the student body, the town, or the aftermath, and the way the family has been treated.

Your logic is flawed in that you refuse to allow for divergent opinions. Not doing so completely over rules the capability of having a reasonble discourse. Then again, ignoring what was said, and twisting it around to imply something that was clearly not said does the same thing. Either way, we all lose, because the opportunity to discuss is lost in the desire to defame Blair, and her family.

I agree, she did her own damage, for the record, but I insist, I have never tried to excuse that, only add that the paper has at least an equal measure of responsibility.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 13:46 pm EDT

Cretin,

I discussed that article about halfway up this thread, go back, read, learn.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 13:47 pm EDT

S.Douglas-Smith

--posted by DM @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 13:50 pm EDT

S.Douglas-Smith
You give a very plausible explanation as to how the Courier Post might have come by this information. But if look back at one of your earlier posts, you will see that I am not putting words into your mouth. You said, "Blair filed her suit after EIGHT months of negotiations which the Courier Post was aware of, as one of its employees is related (and "exposed" the plagiarism suddenly) to the School Board's Lead Council. Maybe you meant to say something else but you connected the dots between Courier employee and Board attorney.

--posted by DM @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 13:54 pm EDT

S. Douglass-Smith: I still can not find any indication that the Courier Post or the "wider public" was aware of the contentious situation between the Hornstines and the Moorestown school system until the first public reporting on May 3, 2003 - http://www.southjerseynews.com/issues/may/m050303c.htm.

You mention that the Courier Post was aware of the dispute for eight months – and such was confirmed by one of its employees. Can you please direct me to evidence of that claim?

DM: I’d welcome a pointer to the “[o]ne newspaper article [that] stated…the Courier Post asks its young writers to sign a statement that the work they submit is their own.” Even if they don’t require such, it stands within reason to expect that any high school student knows about the “wrong” of presenting someone else’s words as your own – in any context.

Furthermore, if one is involved in a contentious situation one needs to tread carefully…so as not to attract attention. I suspect Blair never thought she’d be "called to task"; "be caught". After all, she seems to have managed to "navigate the waters" quite well before.

--posted by cambridgema @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 13:57 pm EDT

"As much as you'd like to excuse all the behaviors of the town, and all the threats attacks, and damages done by townsfolk against and to the Hornstines, the simple fact is that 1.) She was entitled to the award, the honor, and the once in a lifetime chance to be the best of something. 2.) Even though it lost, the town still won, because through it's actions it made the outcome the same as if it had won, by threat, intimidation, and harrassment, Blair Hornstine was deprived of her rightful place at the head of her class. 3.) Regardless of what Blair did, it did not warrant the juvinile and repugnant behavior of the student body, the town, or the aftermath, and the way the family has been treated."

Please don't put words in my mouth. I have never tried to excuse all the behaviors of the town. I have never condoned the threats against the Hornstine family.

But just because people egged her house does not mean that plagiarism is suddenly OK.

Whether or not the paper acted appropriately is irrelevant. Blair plagiarized. Refute that, and you may have the beginnings of a good argument.

BTW, YOUR logic is flawed because you continue to engage in ad hominem attacks.

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 13:57 pm EDT

Okay, DM, I can see how you might get that, and to be fair, it could be misleading. However, because the issue was discussed at school board meetings, and was debated in various school meetings, the Courier Post was aware of the ongoing "dialouge" about this situation because Blair was very vocal about her objections to what appeared to be to her, an effort to take away from her accomplishments. Because this had been ongoing from the beginning of the school year, the 8 months is accurate, as it was first broached in September at a school board meeting, (a public gathering).

Blair did file her suit after this period, and the post did not reveal her plagiarism until after the TRO was issued. It seems to me that the point is obvious, but I'm hard headed. I think they sat on it, that's all. I think they were aware of it long before they published it, and I think they waited until after the hearing in order to avoid any appearance of wrongdoing on their part. That's what I think.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 14:03 pm EDT

That's certainly possible.

But either way, Blair is still a plagiarist.

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 14:05 pm EDT

Once again, Cretin, you either can not read, or you have selectively blocked out the myriad times I have said that there is not excuse for plagiarism. Kindly beat your head against your monitor until this sinks in, I do not condone plagiarism, and conversely I do not condone the actions, or lack of them, of the editorial staff of the Courier Post. I have never said that plagiarism is ok, I have said that in relation to the law suit, it is irrelevant, and it is. That the paper may have acted in-appropriately is not irrelevant, because if it had acted as it claims it does, it would have prevented Blairs' essays from ever seeing the light of day, by properly editing the content it sells to it's readership. Discounting the actions as a whole is the same as condoning them, and that is where I object. Give credit where credit is due, and a measure of responsibility to the parties involved... all of them.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 14:09 pm EDT

lets get this straight, Cretin, I never said she wasn't. She is also the valedictorian.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 14:10 pm EDT

Should Blair's plagiarism be excused - and made irrelevant - for review by the Admissions Office at Harvard College (which commonly reconsiders offers of admissions prior to matriculation each Autumn)?

--posted by cambridgema @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 14:15 pm EDT

Cambridgema,

Ultimately, that is entirely up to Harvard. Because their admissions standards may include the possibility of review of such actions, and which may include reconsideration of her admission, it is entirely possible that her plagiarism will result in her being rejected. If that is the case, it will be the fruit of her actions, to which there is relevance in the admissions process at Harvard.

As I have stressed, even if that occurs, it had no bearing on her work at MHS, and was not relevant to the law suit.

It is certainly possible that she will be denied admission to Harvard, and if she is, she will have to live with that particular price forever. Even so, it does not excuse the discrimnatory actions of the School Board, or Mr. Kadri, and it certainly does not dillute the validity of her claims in the lawsuit.

Her future credibility is certainly at risk, and it will take a great deal of effort on her part to overcome it. Perhaps she needs to be denied admission to Harvard, I don't know, but in the end the decission will be made based on merit, and all of the available information to the admissions office of Harvard, and whatever it is, it too, will spark controversy.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 14:24 pm EDT

S. Douglas-Smith: Very well said!

--posted by cambridgema @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 14:26 pm EDT

Creaptin: You are so right. I do attack your character because you tell downright lies. I do believe that I have read either here or on some other blog that "you know the Hornstines" and you had very negative things to say about them. Therefore, I believe you continue to do a character assassination on them. I will research and find your comments.

As far as the "paper" YOUR friend told you Blair signed: Are you sure it was YOUR friend? Not a friend of your neighbor's aunt's bus driver's cousin?Miss Hornstine DID NOT receive, as most Courier Post employees do, a copy of the book of ethics and policy.
You say she signed a paper that she would only submit original works. Well, indulge me for a moment...allow me to be the Devil's Advocate. Since Miss H. was recommended for this "job" by the 25 year head of the English department, do you think it was possible that Blair thought her works were original, just "sprinkled " with a few sentences borrowed from others to make her point? Do you think that she could have possibly been uninformed about how to respect other's thoughts since there are no footnotes in a newspapaer. There are footnotes in books, sometimes in magazines, always in term/school papers, but NEVER in a newspaper. I KNOW she is guilty of plagiarism. I am not trying to get around it. I am just offering you a reasonable thought.She did plagarize. I did not say she didn't. The "discovery" of these papers does not and did not effect her having the highest GPA at MHS and the rightful selection of her as Valedictorian. IT IS DEFINITELY THE BLAIR WITCH HUNT.

As far as her illness - this is where, Creaptin, I want to use any and all negative displays of your information and character. Accute Chronic Fatigue Syndrome is a "debilitating and complex disorder." It can effect your autoimmune system. A sufferer can be disabled from muscle and/or joint pain, skin problems and dizziness along with many others problems. I have taken the liberty of adding a web site here for you so you can educate yourself. It is not so rare, and it DOES have a name. It is a REAL disease. I choose not to debate the merits of this illness. You choose not to believe it authenticity. That is your preogative. That is your further lack of correct info.

http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/diseases/cfs/info.htm

Now let's go to her studies: Blair dropped her AP History for the HONORS History. Her doctors felt that the extra time and work involved in the AP course exceeded the study time that they wanted her to follow. AP to Honors???? Not dropping a course because she had an A-. If she had continued with the AP course, even with the A-, her GPA would have been HIGHER. As far as you, Creaptin, how many AP courses did you have? Honors? Valedictorian roles?

Other students at MHS, you asked about...Yes, quite a few other students have been schooled at home for periods of time under the IEP programs. They may have run the gamut from broken limbs to chemotherapy,from weeks to years. The Moorestown School District is bound by law to educate all resident students.

Yes, PE vs. paper? Mostly every student would like that choice. I am willing to bet the house and car that physicially disabled students would chose the PE if they could.

Between your "whispering down the lane" comments, your non-illness belief and your previous terrible comments about the Hornstines (I will find it and pull it up), I do question your comments and character.

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 15:17 pm EDT

"I graduated from Moorestown High in 2001. I can assure you that all the awful things that people are saying about Ms. Hornstine are TRUE. I wouldn't put anything past her and her family.

Posted by: cretin on May 12, 2003 01:25 AM "

Here is one of them. I do "speak" the truth.

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 15:27 pm EDT

"OK, I went to Ms. Hornstine's high school. Thank god I'm out of there now. Anyway, I am familiar with the antics of this family. Ms. Hornstine's "illness" is quite a convenient invention. She was able to study at home and be graded by "tutors." With the help of her father, she was able to choose who would grade her essays and which activities to join to ensure her spot at Harvard. She is following in her brother's footsteps by pretending to care of the community, all the while manipulating the system to her benefit.

As much as I hated that high school and was glad to be rid of the teacher and administrators there, I must say that I would have hated it even more if I had attended while Blair was there.

She has played the system well. Let's see how she fares when she is forced to be with people who can play it even better than she has.

Posted by: cretin at May 10, 2003 08:28 PM

Blair owes US an apology for costing the school district (i.e. US) so much money.

Are you Blair, by the way? You sound like her, except for the fact the you haven't burst into tears yet.

Was Blair's A+ phys ed grade factored into her GPA? If not, it should be.

Do you deny that daddy instructed her tutors to give her A+'s?

Do you deny that the grading standards are different?

Do you have proof that her "disability" even exists?

The fact of the matter is that her grades starting slipping during sophomore year, so daddy realized that his daughter's interests would be better served if she got to study at home.

Daddy is a very influential man. It's no secret how Blair got all those A+'s.

Posted by: cretin at May 11, 2003 04:12 PM "

--posted by Here are two more; One more to go. @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 15:40 pm EDT

Although the plagiarism issue wouldn't have affected the main issue of grade status, it really does speak to either character or work habits. She can't be the smartest girl in the school who lives solely for academics and not know that you don't use another's words as your own. The argument about not knowing how to attribue dosn't wash when she carefully changed some of their words to make them "hers". Such a smart girl would know to write, as President Clinton said, "Blah blah blah." Easy. Rather than a conspiracy, maybe the newspaper just checked her stuff for spelling and printed them. They were essays by a high school kid, not news stories relaying facts. Why should they have been fact checked anyway?

--posted by Amused from Afar @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 16:12 pm EDT

A few comments:

Mrs. MM wrote, "The Courier Post, regardless of your take on it, has an obligation under the 1st Amendment to make sure that protected speech, (quotes, ect.,) is not allowed to be published without proper attribution ...."

As a legal matter, this statement is wildly inaccurate. The First Amendment states, in pertinent part, "Government shall make no law . . . abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press . . . "

A newspaper has no constitutional obligation to prevent plagiarism or inaccurate reporting. Those duties, such as they are, are actually EXCEPTIONS to the First Amendment that are found in places such as copyright law and state laws concerning libel and defamation.

In addition, it is ludicrous to pass the buck to the editors for not checking Ms. Horntstine's work (or even intentionally allowing her to publish plagiarized editorials). The New Yorker this week (or maybe it was last week) had an interesting article about the Jayson Blair situation. The author, a former New York Times reporter, discusses the fact that newspaper editors do NOT normally check the accuracy/originality of their reporters' work. They do not have the time, and perhaps more importantly, reporters are expected to be accurate and to avoid plagiarism without the need for editorial babysitters.

And even if there was a conspiracy at work at the paper to discredit Ms. Hornstine (which I doubt, but I suppose it is possible) -- well she sure gave them a great opportunity didn't she? Whose fault is that?

I realize Ms. Hornstine was not a reporter, but if she is as smart as everyone claims, surely she is smart enough to know that passing off other's words as her own is not just unethical but stupid. I'm sorry, but her excuse about footnotes is totally unbelieveable. You don't need footnotes to give proper attribution, you just need quotation marks and a little phrase like, "As Bill Clinton thoughtfully said...."

Now, it is terrible that other students threatened Ms. Hornstine, egged her house, etc. That's inexcusable. BUT, it is also easy to understand why she is so despised. Envy, yes. Irrational dislike of a girl simply for being bookish and nerdy, yes. But also, rational dislike (I call it "rational dislike" in the sense that it is a natural reaction to Ms. Blair's behavior) for a girl who seems to have manipulated the system to her own advantage, who has intentionally set herself apart from her peers for whatever reason, who has managed to receive special treatment because of a disability that strikes many as bogus (I'm not saying it really is bogus, just that it sounds bogus), and who then sues the school because she feels she has not been appropriately "acknowledged." Even her charitable activities engender resentment because everyone is thinking, is she really such a great humanitarian or is she just great at finding ways to pad her resume by helping the so-called "underprivileged"? Kind of like the queen tossing coins the peasants? And publishing "editorials" in the paper -- I mean, come on, who does she think she is? George Will?

In other words, Ms. Hornstine is just too perfectly packaged. She is a designer kid. People hate her not because of who she is but because of what she REPRESENTS. It is the same rage that people feel when they get cut off on the freeway by a Lexus SUV and they see that the driver is yacking on a cell phone. It is the same rage they feel when they are at the airport, waiting in an interminable line for their cruddy coach seats, and they watch the first class passengers being whisked through. They fervently hope that the Lexus will get pulled over by the cops or the airline will lose the first class passenger's luggage. When it happens, they feel unmitigated glee. It is interesting from a sociological perspective although certainly sad and tragic for Ms. Hornstine herself. I was a pretty nerdy kid who got picked on a lot, so I feel a lot of sympathy for her. However, she had better get used to the animosity she generates -- because it's human nature. All her brains and accomplishments and honors and Harvard degrees won't buy her anything in life, except maybe a long term lease to a therapist's couch, if she doesn't understand that.

Having a high GPA does not guarantee success in life and honors like being Valedictorian are completely meaningless. Pure intelligence is unquestionably an advantage, but unless you are going into a field like theoretical physics, you will get nowhere in life without an intuitive understanding of how other people tick. Consider that Bill Gates got into Harvard but dropped out, and Steven Spielberg never even finished high school. The fact is, you cannot run a corporation, or a movie studio, or law firm, or a university department, or even a corner grocery store without knowing how to inspire and persuade other people. That includes people who may be stupider and lazier and less motivated than you are; people who are envious of your success and would love to see you fail; and people who would gladly crawl over you on their way to the top. Guess what folks: high school NEVER ENDS.

Mattie

--posted by Mattie @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 16:14 pm EDT

Mrs. Motherfucker,

I stand by what I have said in the past. Thanks for posting it here. I'm sure it will be informative for all.

A good friend whom I have known for 8 years told me that all those who write for the Courier Post must sign a statement attesting to the fact that they will only submit original work. She is currently working there for the summer, so I think she'd know.

However, exceptions are often made for Blair, so maybe she didn't sign it?

I don't know why you're so eager to defend her plagiarism. You can be pro-lawsuit and still be anti-plagiarism. You can think that she should have been valedictorian and still be against her dishonest acts.

Unless you can prove that Blair did not plagiarize, you will continue to look really bad by defending her actions AT THE COURIER POST.

P.S. Ad hominem attacks are logically fallacious. Please learn how to spell my name, and then I will learn how to spell yours. Thanks!

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 17:32 pm EDT

Mrs. Motherfucker,

Blair does not have CFS. She has a CFS-like illness.

Please get your facts straight and stop telling downright lies!

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 17:34 pm EDT

Mrs. Motherfucker,

The 25 year head of the English department is a Hornstine family friend. So what if she recommended that Blair submit her writings to a newspaper? That's like my mother writing me a college recommendation.

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 17:38 pm EDT

Mrs MM,

This is exactly the problem that I have with the whole situation. The girl is spending 12 hours a day on school and charity. People are entitled to question how much her charitable activities, however admirable and good for her resume, are taking out of her fragile constitution, and whether the taxpayers should be forced to make it all possible by providing tutors to her wealthy family so she can be schooled at home. It is reasonable to ask if, by giving up some of these other activities, she might not be able to attend school with her classmates. If she is so ill that she cannot attend school, how can they possibly justify 3 or 4 hours a day of charity work? Then want to be allowed to drop a course because all the work is killing her? She has a right for accommodations to be made for her education. She does not have a right to make others pay so she can engage in these other activities.

If it weren't for all of the other things she was finding the time and energy to do, it would be a touching story of a young person overcoming a debilitating illness to rise to the top of her class. As it is, it looks more like a obsessive/compulsive child, whose parents are allowing her to destroy her health in the blind pursuit of perfection.

And the continued defense of her plagarism by blaming it on the editors is lame. They are going to check it for grammatical errors, not to try to find out if she lifted whole passages from Bill Clinton Thanksgiving address.

--posted by Tom D @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 17:39 pm EDT

Mattie: You attributed the first paragraph and possibly more of your post to me. I did not say any of that.

Manipulated, you say? She followed the Moorestown High School Handbook and the laws of the State. Entitled? Yes, she was entitled to as much of an education as a mentally challanged individual or a "normal" youth. Intentionally setting herself apart? Come on. Because she wasn't the Homecoming queen, etc., she intentionally set herself apart. Because she collected prom gowns for the underpriviledged instead of getting her nails done? Bunk!

The Lexus SUV was a poor analogy. Cutting one off is punishable by a ticket/fine. Talking on the phone is against the law in some states. She did not break the law!!!! That was the problem. She followed the rule. The school broke its own rule. Where do you get such comparisons?

Then you speak about "first Class passengers." They paid for that upgrade. That's no different in someone having a more expensive car or a bigger boat. They earned the money to buy those luxuries. Miss H. worked hard and earned her "Mercedes." It was just that the school wouldn't let her drive it.

Having a high GPA or being Valedictorian does not guarantee you a better life. Neither does a Harvard education. Having a Harvard education is something that can never be taken away from you. It does not mean that you will have more economic and career advantages, but there is a good chance. Chances are a Harvard education will open doors for you that can't be opened by other means. Students work very hard to be admitted.She may find many of her own (nerdy) there. They all do not generate animosity. A Harvard graduate - that does say something! For all the ones who left Harvard, there are thousands who graduated. That must be why five times more than can be accepted apply. That must be why all A students with close to 1600 on the SAT's do not get accepted. Each student who gets accepted must have a little something more than the other "guy." Thousands who can top Bill Gates in many ways; hundreds who put Spielberg where he is.

In this case, parents included, Grade School never ended.

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 17:40 pm EDT

Mrs. Motherfucker,

How is how many AP or honors classes I took relevant?

Please enlighten me.

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 17:41 pm EDT

Mrs. Motherfucker,

How do you know the Hornstines so well?

For a "family friend," you are spreading a lot of misinformation.

Please get your facts straight!

Thanks.

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 17:43 pm EDT

Mrs. Motherfucker,

Do you have any proof that Blair worked so hard?

Everyone works hard.

What makes Blair special? (besides her father)

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 17:44 pm EDT

"Entitled? Yes, she was entitled to as much of an education as a mentally challanged individual or a "normal" youth. "

But she didn't get "as much of an education." She got more. Unless every other student at MHS had access to her tutors, she was given an unfair advantage.

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 17:47 pm EDT

"Chances are a Harvard education will open doors for you that can't be opened by other means."

You bet there are other means!

Can you say Yale, Princeton, Penn, Brown, Dartmouth, Cornell, Columbia, Stanford, Chicago, Rice, Johns Hopkins, Northwestern, Caltech, MIT, Duke, Amherst, Williams, Swarthmore, Claremont McKenna, Washington & Lee, need I go on?

Harvard is a great school, but this is a big country. It's OK to go outside of Cambridge.

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 17:57 pm EDT

Well said, Tom D.. Your paragraph 2 statement about Blair being OC and her parents "allowing" her to destroy her health touched on something I've been thinking. To the contrary, I wonder if she has been driven by her parent(s) to constantly do more and be the best no matter what the cost. Seems like anything that didn't improve the resume went by the wayside (acting, music). Maybe she would have liked to take a breather and enjoy some of the more normal H.S. activities Mrs. M.M. tells us Blair was so uninterested in. Actually she sounds like a sort of isolated, lonely kid completely dominated by her parents to me. Now he's following her to college as well. Creatin, did you graduate with her brother? Was there the same family dynamics going on? Just wondering?

--posted by Amused from Afar @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 18:03 pm EDT

Oops - Cretin, not Creatin, so sorry!

--posted by Amused @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 18:05 pm EDT

Amused,

No, I didn not graduate with the brother (Adam). He was two years older than me.

I didn't know him personally, but he seemed like a nice guy (funny, able to laugh at himself, etc.). He actually went to class (!), and unlike Blair, he managed to score a 1600 on the SAT. Let's just say he was a cut above, both in terms of character and intelligence.

Adam and Blair did participate in the same activities (service, debate, more service, more debate). I will not pass judgment on what they chose to do on their own time. These are not the activities that I would have chosen or enjoyed, but that is irrelevant.

Anyway, I'd say that both Adam and Blair played the "college game" to the max. It seems that Blair had a little trouble following in her brother's footsteps. Hence this fiasco...

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 18:13 pm EDT

Creaptin writes: "A good friend whom I have known for 8 years told me that all those who write for the Courier Post must sign a statement attesting to the fact that they will only submit original work. She is currently working there for the summer, so I think she'd know"

Exactly, my point. She is working there NOW for the summer. She probably had to sign the paperwork NOW because THEY , The Courier, NEGLECTED TO GIVE SAME TO BLAIR TO SIGN or did not have any such thing last October.

I am; I am. I did not defend Blair's plagiarism. I question how it came out. I do not think the plagiarism was done purposely. My thoughts were possibly that they were blown out of proportion because of her lawsuit. I wonder how many other student authors could pass the "smell" test.

I KNOW that Blair plagiarized.I believe BLAIR DID NOT DELIBERATELY PLAGIARIZE. I believe SHE EARNED THE RIGHT TO BE VALEDICTORIAN.

I believe she has CFS and MORE. I believe SHE HAS A RIGHT TO PRIVACY. I believe SHE DOESN'T HAVE TO ANSWER TO YOU OR ANYONE ELSE WHY SHE IS SICK. I believe SHE IS A BRILLIANT YOUNG LADY. MHS ACCEPTED HER ILLNESS after having her examined and her medical reports reviewed. IF MOORESTOWN, HER DOCTORS AND THE BOE ACCEPTED IT, WHY CAN'T YOU?

I believe YOU DO NOT LIKE THE HORNSTINES AND ARE A FOOL. I BELIEVE you have a personal vendetta against one or more of the family. I BELIEVE you might know who spray painted their home, egged their home, called with obscenities, etc.

I BELIEVE THAT Mary Bettancourt, the respected and exceptional teacher of 43 or so years, the recently retired 25 year head of English at MHS taught Blair and her Brother. I BELIEVE that Mrs. Bettancourt coached them through Debate and Mock Trial. I BELIEVE that Mrs. Bettancourt only got to know the Hornstine children through school. I KNOW THAT MRS. BETTANCOURT WAS NOT A FAMILY OR PERSONAL FRIEND. I KNOW That Mrs. Bettancourt believes that Blair is a bright student and deserves all the accolades. I KNOW that is why Mrs. Bettancourt has gone to bat for her. I KNOW THAT MANY OTHER ACTIVE TEACHERS WOULD COME OUT PUBLICALLY, BUT BECAUSE THEIR CONTRACTS ARE UP, AND KADRI AND THE BOE ARE THEIR BOSSES, THEY quietly support her in the background.

I BET that Mrs. Bettancourt was one of your teachers if you really went to MHS.

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 18:18 pm EDT

Cretin - Thanks for the clarification. Wonder how Adam will like dear ole Dad showing up at college? Or maybe I have it wrong and Dad is a pussycat.

--posted by Amused @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 18:23 pm EDT

"It seems that Blair had a little trouble following in her brother's footsteps. Hence this fiasco...

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 18:13 pm EDT "

Hence....that must be the bone that is stuck up your A**.

P.S. I know you, don't I. I hope I am not sorry that I do.

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 18:25 pm EDT

Dad and Adam get along famously. Dad teaches during at Harvard during winter break. Adam is not usually there.

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 18:26 pm EDT

Mrs. Motherfucker,

Since I never participated in debate, Mrs. Bettancourt never had the privilege of teaching me. I was never a fan, though. From what I saw, she looked like the type who would pick favorites. Ick.

I BELIEVE THAT BLAIR PLAGIARIZED INTENTIONALLY. I don't believe that Blair thought that she would be caught.

SHE may be smart, BUT SHE IS NO MORE brilliant THAN I AM. GAG ME WITH A SPOON.

The PLAGIARISM and the VALEDICTORIAN issue are two separate ISSUES. YOU HAVE LOST THE ABILITY to view them OBJECTIVELY. SINCE you wanted BLAIR to be valedictorian, YOU convinced yourself that the plagiarism WAS AN ACCIDENT. YOU CAN BE PRO-BLAIR-LAWSUIT and anti-PLAGIARISM. YOU don't have to DEFEND her ON ALL COUNTS.

I DON'T ACCEPT BLAIR'S ILLNESS BECAUSE SHE HAS NO SYMPTOMS. She never even claimed to have CFS. There is a test for CFS, so she decided to contract another ILLNESS. HOW CAN YOU ADVOCATE PRIVATE tutoring for select students? ALL students should have access to private tutors.

By the way, HOW MANY AP COURSES DID YOU TAKE?

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 18:26 pm EDT

remove the first during.

--posted by mmm @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 18:27 pm EDT

I sincerely DOUBT that you know ME.

Nice try, though.

I AM SURE that ADAM and DAD get along. I NEVER said THAT they didn't.

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 18:27 pm EDT

AP courses were not given when I went to school. I have post graduate degrees in several subjects.

Please, please Creaptin, get your facts straight. Thee is no specific test for CFS. CFS closely mimics Lupus and several other autoimmune illnesses. Again, I will insert paragraphs that support my knowledge and toss your opinion down the loo. Yes, You should be gagged.

..."If a patient has had six or more consecutive months of severe fatigue that is reported to be unrelieved by sufficient bed rest and that is accompanied by nonspecific symptoms, including flu-like symptoms, generalized pain, and memory problems, the physician should further investigate the possibility that the patient may have CFS.

How Physicians Diagnose CFS

The first step in the investigation is obtaining a detailed medical history and performing a complete physical examination of the patient. Initial testing should include a mental status examination, which ordinarily will involve a short discussion in the office or a brief oral test. A standard series of laboratory tests of the patient's blood and urine should be performed to help the physician identify other possible causes of illness. If test results suggest an alternative explanation for the patient's symptoms, additional tests may be performed to confirm that possibility. If no cause for the symptoms is identified, the physician may render a diagnosis of CFS if the other conditions of the case definition are met (see What Is CFS?, part a). A diagnosis of idiopathic chronic fatigue could be made if a patient has been fatigued for 6 months or more, but does not meet the symptom criteria for CFS.

....Appropriate Tests for Routine Diagnosis of CFS
While the number and type of tests performed may vary from physician to physician, the following tests constitute a typical standard battery to exclude other causes of fatiguing illness: alanine aminotransferase (ALT), albumin, alkaline phosphatase (ALP), blood urea nitrogen (BUN), calcium, complete blood count, creatinine, electrolytes, erythrocyte sedimentation rate (ESR), globulin, glucose, phosphorus, thyroid stimulating hormone (TSH), total protein, transferrin saturation, and urinalysis. Further testing may be required to confirm a diagnosis for illness other than CFS. For example, if a patient has low levels of serum albumin together with an above-normal result for the blood urea nitrogen test, kidney disease would be suspected. The physician may choose to repeat the relevant tests and possibly add new ones aimed specifically at diagnosing kidney disease. If autoimmune disease is suspected on the basis of initial testing and physical examination, the physician may request additional tests, such as for antinuclear antibodies..."

I only advocate teaching each student to the fullest, either as provided by law or their own ability. All students DO have access to private tutoring. It is just that some have to pay for it. Many, many, many parents chose to pay for their childrens' tutors because admission to college is more competitive each year.

Poor Blair, she only scored a 1570 on her boards. Now tell me, Creaptin, did Adam score 1600 his first time? How many times did he take the test? Get all the facts, please.

--posted by Mrs. M.M. @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 18:41 pm EDT

Creaptin: You did go to MHS, didn't you? Graduated 2 years ago?

--posted by mmm @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 18:42 pm EDT

I'm the one the said maybe Adam would like to be at school independent of his family. I didn't really mean that he and his father didn't get along. I've been fishing for clues as to whether the dad is an overbearing taskmaster with Blair or possibly Adam. I know that when I went away to college, it was exciting to move hundreds of miles away and be independent and having my parents show up would not have been my favorite thing. But maybe Dad is just driving over for the day, how far is Moorestown from Cambridge anyway?

--posted by Amused @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 18:43 pm EDT

That would be quite the commute! Moorestown, NJ to Cambridge, MA is a 5+ hour drive, according to Yahoo! Maps:

http://maps.yahoo.com/py/ddResults.py?Pyt=Tmap&tarname=&tardesc=&osd=&newname=&newdesc=&dsd=&newHash=&newTHash=&newErr=&newTErr=&newFL=Use+Address+Below&newaddr=&newcsz=moorestown%2C+nj&newcountry=us&newTFL=Use+Address+Below&newtaddr=&newtcsz=cambridge%2C+ma&newtcountry=us&Submit=Get+Directions

-adam

--posted by Adam @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 18:50 pm EDT

Actually, I bet Cretin and Mrs. M.M. know each other better than they think. Reading old posts, etc. I'm pretty sure that Mrs. M.M. is a math teacher at MHS.

--posted by Amused @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 18:52 pm EDT

Judge and Mrs. Hornstine are the parents of two exceptional children. Their lives are centered around their children, MHS, etc. As I have previously stated, Mrs. H. was very active in the Home and School Council, the community playhouse,etc. Judge H coached basketball, Little league, etc. when his children were small. They are not overbearing taskmasters. They are interested in their childrens' futures and attempt to provide whatever is necessary for them to get the best education each can obtain.(Don't forget that despite the MHS graduating class of 257, 3 are going to Harvard. It is a "brilliant" and competitive class. This class always has been a joy.) The family used to travel, but when Blair got ill about 4 years ago, the travel was curtailed. Mrs. H. went to Harvard once to see Adam before his graduation. Judge went up there less than a handful of times. A couple of the times he went there was to teach. As I said, Adam, was not there at the time. (Well, don't call me a liar...maybe a day or two overlapped)

Overbearing? Doubt it. Taskmaster? Don't think so.
Provider to high achievers? Yes

--posted by MMM @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 18:54 pm EDT

Thanks Adam - Guess I could have looked that up myself, those tiny states are bigger than they look! So dad will have to bunk over/get an apt. to teach.

--posted by Amused @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 18:59 pm EDT

Mrs. MM - I'm sorry I misatributed that quote about the 1st amendment to you. Actually I should have attributed to Mr. Douglas-Smith. My mistake. Certainly is an ironic mistake given the subject under discussion.

You write, "Then you speak about 'first Class passengers.' They paid for that upgrade. That's no different in someone having a more expensive car or a bigger boat."

You've missed my point entirely. I wasn't saying that Ms. Hornstine IS equivalent to the Lexus driver or the first class passenger in some moral, ethical or actual sense ... I'm saying that other people FEEL that way about her. Everything about her story smacks of money, elitism, special privileges, and snobbery. You can argue about whether that reaction is justified by the facts, but nevertheless, when people read about Blair Hornstine, they want to gag. It is the same sentiment that causes people to slap bumper stickers on their cars that say, "My C-student can beat up your honor student" or "Die Yuppie Scum." Is it envy? Of course it is envy. But the more interesting question to ask is why this particular girl and this particular story makes people so envious, so enraged, and so brimming with schadenfreude when they see her stumble? (schadenfreude = "a malicious satisfaction in the misfortunes of others")

I think I am a reasonably intelligent person. Actually, I scored in the 99th percentile on the SAT without ever having a single tutor or taking a single SAT prep course. In fact, I had never heard of SAT prep courses. I went to a state university -- the only place I applied -- because my parents didn't have a lot of money and they weren't sophisticated enough to get me a college application coach in the 8th grade who would help me develop my 5-year Ivy League Plan. So I guess that makes me a member of the great unwashed who the Hornstines don't want their precious daughter to associate with or, God forbid, turn into by getting an A- or having to settle for the Univ. of Pennsylvania instead of Harvard. (Excluding, of course, such unwashed persons who are "underprivileged" enough to provide Ms. Hornstine with convenient material for college admission essays via carefully choreographed charity projects.)

I harbor no personal animosity toward Ms. Hornstine. I have never met her and I wish her the best of luck getting beyond her current circumstances. Might I suggest that the whole affair would make an interesting term paper.

Mattie

--posted by Mattie @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 19:02 pm EDT

Mattie: I do understand your analogies. I will try to respond without sounding myself like some elitist or provide fodder for the "not as priviledged."

Watch me get pounded...I won't respond.

Moorestown, N.J. is a very wealthy upscale community on the whole.Don't get me completely wrong, middle class families thrive there, also. Many professional families live there as well as quite a few Professional sport's players from the Philadelphia Eagles, Philadelphia Flyers, etc. Many, many of the Mothers of these students taught school at one time or another. They have too much knowledge, too much time and possibly too little information.

There is an excellent private school in Moorestown, a Friends School. It used to be that most of the affluent children went to that school. Now, due to some wonderful teachers and courses, the public MHS seems to be the school to attend. (Sure, this will be disputed)As I have said MHS graduated 257 this year, with 3 going to Harvard. (3 from a public school is almost unheard of) I believe that the other 254 students have acceptances from most of the Ivys, Duke, Stanford, on and on. Million dollar homes in this area are more the norm than the exceptional.

Education is important to these parents. It is basically "what" they can give their kids. They can afford to send them to the Harvards, the grad schools,Europe, etc.

Each year competition to get into "good" schools is more difficult. With a highly competitive, bright class, wealthy and/or successful professional parents, get into the fray and the competition grows. Everyone can't go to Harvard, Stanford, etc. Those schools take the cream of the crop. Each student needs to outdo the other one. Parents get involved. Parents don't want fair competition. They only care about "their" kid. What do they do? Tutors are paid, coaches are hired, alums are wined and dined, plans are followed. College advisors/coaches know what each school is looking for. Parents zoom in on one particular or a group of schools. They try, if the student is smart enough, to follow this plan. They have the money and where with all to do this.

I think the animosity rages on because the Hornstines' have already had a Valedictorian and a Harvard student. Share...okay, that's lame, but I think you know what I mean. As a student, Blair DID deserve to be the Valedictorian, despite the Plagiarism, petty jealousy, name calling, and so on.

Point of Info: Kenny Mirkin, the Saluditorian,has a physician Mother and a Lawyer Father. This is not too unusual in Moorestown.

It's like watching Tennis. Many people can't wait for one of the William sisters to lose. Give someone else a chance. But each of these girls is tops. Should they roll over and die just to please the public?

And that is my tale of woe...

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 19:43 pm EDT

Mrs. Motherfucker,

So you teach math? Which classes? Maybe we do know each other, after all.

Given how bitchy you are, my guess is that you are Mrs. Rowe. How close am I?!

Blair may be smart, but she's no genius. Geniuses don't need to repeat classes. Geniuses don't plagiarize. Heck, smart people don't even plagiarize.

So Mrs. Rowe, how did you become so friendly with the family? Did you provide Blair with private tutoring? Do you think it's right the taxpayers paid for Blair's tutoring, but the rest of us have to foot the bill ourselves?

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 19:48 pm EDT

I only took the SAT once. I guess I'm smarter than Blair!

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 19:49 pm EDT

Amused, I think MM is either Rowe or Izzo. What's your guess?

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 19:50 pm EDT

Hey Motherfucker,

I think you should spend the summer brushing up on your teaching skills rather than frequenting message boards.

Or better yet, give up teaching altogether! It would be no great loss...

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 19:52 pm EDT

Motherfucker,

People might take your posts more seriously if you came off as more OBJECTIVE.

Admitting that you are a family friend is NOT going to help your arguments.

You should recuse yourself before we find out who you really are.

Izzo.. cough cough...

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 19:58 pm EDT

Creaptin: I notice your "ad dress for success" is by calling Mrs. M. M. one of the larger words in your vocabulary. I, too, remember you. Was it from Indian Guides or one of the Indian type organizations run by the "Y". I remember your Indian name. "Putz-in-Hand."

" MR." M. M.

--posted by Mr. Moorestown @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 19:59 pm EDT

You must be really smart - you don't even know what "cretin" means.

I would actually be more insulted by being called "cretin," but that's too hard a word for you...

I remember you, too! Weren't you caught fondling a 9th grader?

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 20:06 pm EDT

Cretin- Sorry but I don't have any idea who she might be. I looked on the school website but it didn't offer much insight, only a list of names which mean nothing to me. I'm 1500 miles away from Moorestown and have no additional information other than the tidbits gleaned from the postings here. I'd be willing to bet I'm spot on about the math teacher thing though. Maybe one with a little beef against Kadri or the school board for a past slight?

--posted by Amused @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 20:07 pm EDT

Well, when we find out who she is, she's not going to want to show her face in public for a long, long time.

My bet is now on Izzo, because she had a son who graduated a few years back. I never liked that woman. She kind of reminded me of Betancourt (the now infamous English teacher).

What's the matter, Izzo? Did they not grant you tenure? Don't be bitter. Life goes on!

Haha, you've been found out!

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 20:12 pm EDT

Creaptin: You never will get it. That is okay. That is why there are winners and losers, chocolate and vanilla.

You suggest that I should recuse myself because I am a family friend. I would have disagreed with you, as I don't consider myself from the same milieu as the Hornstines. On further review, I looked up the meanings of friend and of famiy. Family Friend is not defined as one by my dictionary.

As I read the following meaning for family, I have to take it you were correct. Then I proceeded to the meaning for friend. Again, I see that you know more than I thought. I am proud to be considered a "Family Friend." I wonder if the Hornstines would agree.

" : a group of people united by certain convictions or a common affiliation"

"a : one that is not hostile 3 : one that favors or promotes something "

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 20:12 pm EDT

Amused: I have no "beefs" with MHS. The school and BOE have always been fair and honest with me.The students are great. For the most part, the administration and other teachers are a decent bunch. As for Kadri...well, he is another story. He came to MHS with a Napoleon complex. His outspokenness, his reaction to calm an outraged, incorrect parent, his actions and his lies will cost the BOE a large financial lesson. The BOE can't afford to spend more money because of him. In their search to find the "right" superintendent,an excess amount of money was spent to find the "wrong" man around the corner...in a neighboring community. Now the backlash from his actions will be a financial drain on the school district.

Now to Creaptin: Sure I am not LaMarra or Lehrer? Do you keep in touch with Volzone or the Binter kids? Or aren't they in your unsocial circle?

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 20:41 pm EDT

Cretin,

Your language is not needed. It lowers you and what might otherwise be valid opinions. I am the first to admit I don't always agree with you, and I even question your ability to read, but you don't need the language. Name calling generally indicates an inability to deal with the subject matter in a mature, adult fashion.

Mr. MM, you have been borderline in that past regarding Native American peoples, and I have overlooked it. Your comment about Indian Guides, and such, and the reference to "Putz In Hand" as an "Indian Name" is not only uncalled for, it is an afront on the whole, to anyone of Native decent. Much the way the Hornstines have been bashed for their religious background, (which I also decried; the attacks not the background), your characterization of Native Americans as somehow lessor, or uneducated is not only repugnant, it is insulting.

Maddie, I was going to refer to the comment you commented on, but after the recent rash of insulting, and pointless barrages of childishness, I am sorry to say I forgot, and I haven't the energy to look up. Either that, or the desire.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 20:41 pm EDT

Mrs MM
I was WONDERING where you FOUND that INFORMATION on CFS? I KNOW that THERE is NO PLACE FOR footnotes, and YOU DID not sign ANY STATEMENTS, but PERHAPS you could TYPE "The PDA states THAT..."

Ironically, I was a co-valedictorian at my school(and while we are sharing our stats, 99% on the SAT) by dropping a class, but unlike Blair I was liked enough to not be the subject of threats and vandalism.

I guess the only conclusion I can come to regarding the MHS valedictorian is that despite her shady maneuvers, the Board approved everything. I mean, what else can you say. You can not like her for it, but the inner-jerk in me is quite impressed with her GPA finagling.

Now Hardvard and plagiarism, well, it will be interesting to hear what Harvard will have to say (if anything).

--posted by sigh @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 20:42 pm EDT

Definition of CRETIN

a stupid, vulgar, or insensitive person : CLOD, LOUT

That said it all.

--posted by For those who are reading @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 20:48 pm EDT

Sigh: The same place you get a map, a telephone number, etc. THE INTERNET. I believe I put quote marks around information I "stole" off of web sites.
Next time, I look up a telephone number on the web, I will be sure to write in my phone book.

John Smith
According to "the Ultimate White Pages" (111)555-1212

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 20:53 pm EDT

For Mattie, I apologize for spelling your name Maddie, as I said I forgot, didn't have the energy to look up, or the desire, either way, I mispelled your name and I apologize sincerely.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 21:10 pm EDT

MM, I'm sorry you're lacking a chromosome. What is it, Down's Syndrome? Such a shame...

I'm sorry you are unable to spell or pronounce my name. C-R-E-T-I-N. Maybe if you practice real hard every day, you'll finally get it right.

Anyway, I don't think you're a teacher at MHS. I don't think you even live in Moorestown. You don't even know the Hornstines, either.

You went to the MHS alumni page, where you saw the names of two people in my graduating class. Jennifer Binter and David Volzone. I was not friends with either of them. But I think you should know that Dave died in a car crash in 2002. If you were a teacher at MHS, you would have known that. Heck, if you even LIVED in Moorestown, you would have known that.

So now that the game is up, what is your excuse for pretending to know the Hornstines? Do you even know what county Moorestown is in?

Please, go back to the group home. It's past your bedtime.

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 21:15 pm EDT

Mrs. M.M. - I didn't say you had a beef with the school just possibly Kadri or the board and you confirmed that. I've read nothing about him but will accept your statements about Kadri largely based on the terrible record various local school districts in my area have had w/ hiring good administrators they pay them off just to leave before their contracts are over. What do you mean "his reaction to calm an outraged, incorrect parent...dosn't make sense to me?

--posted by Amused from Afar @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 21:16 pm EDT

Editing note: Please insert a period after administratiors and begin a new sentence w/ They
Thank you.

--posted by Amused @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 21:18 pm EDT

Amused, give it up.

MM doesn't know the Hornstines. He doesn't even know anyone in Moorestown.

troll...

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 21:18 pm EDT

Amused. Dr. Shangold, the Mother of Kenny Mirkin, the young man who wanted to be Valedictorian and who joined in the suit against Ms. H. began all this ruckus
by going to the new Superintendent and asking if her son was going to be Valedictorian. She surmised that Kenny had excellent marks and knew that Blair did also. She "encouraged" Kadri to investigate. She put a lot of pressure on him. That was the beginning...
"Incorrect" - I used that word because she thought Kenny had the highest GPA with the most AP and Honors courses.

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 21:43 pm EDT

Creaptin: I was referring to Eric Binter. Please put that in your balloon and float away with your hot air. I have nothing further to say to you. I certainly am not the most intelligent on this blog. I am one with truthful information and the reality of the Valedictorian situation.

You made it clear of your dislike of the Hornstines. At first, I just let that roll over. Now I see that you do not like or believe anyone. You are hostile.
Your "handle" does fit your personality. I truly wonder if that was your given name at birth. If not, it must be the "nickname" by which you are familial known.

I lowered myself almost to your level for some hee haws. Now go away. I have seen your past "scribbles" on other blogs. I thought you were a misinformed fool then. Now you have raised the bar.

Make like a firecracker and blow up!

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 21:58 pm EDT

Good troll catch, Cretin. He/she/it sure spent a lot of time on this. I was wondering how a teacher could let her husband make such rude, juvenile comments. Thanks Adam for an interesting and informative site. It was a fun way to burn up a couple of hours! Y'all go out and have a fun holiday weekend. Cretin, you're young, smart and probably cute, go have some fun! Bye all.

--posted by Amused @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 21:59 pm EDT

Thanks, Amused. You flatter me!

It's amazing. Once MM was found out, he left rather quickly! Good riddance to bad rubbish...

Happy 4th of July everyone!!!

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 22:37 pm EDT

Mrs. MM wrote: "Education is important to these parents. It is basically 'what' they can give their kids. They can afford to send them to the Harvards, the grad schools,Europe, etc."

That is my point exactly. People have to wonder whether Ms. Hornstine's success is the result of her own talents or whether she has just had success handed to her on a silver platter by her rich and apparently savvy parents. There are probably thousands of students who are as smart and derserving as Blair is -- or even smarter and more deserving -- but they are not holding a "Welcome to Harvard" letter because they did not play the game as well. Now if you are saying that Blair HAD to play the game because everyone else is playing it, especially in her town, that is a valid point. In which case it sounds like people are royally pissed off at the Hornstines for playing the game too well -- or (some would argue) for cheating by having their daughter fake a disability in order to get special treatment. I'm not saying that Blair is actually faking a disability; I'm just saying that is the perception.

Based on Mrs. MM's description of Moorestown, the fact that a lot of students end up at "Ivies" and other top schools doesn't impress me too much. If the parents can afford to pay for tutors and SAT preparation courses and college application counselors and all the rest, then their kids would have to be incrediably moronic and ill-favored not to do well. I don't doubt that many of these kids are smart and ambitious but the fact that they get into an "Ivy" -- well that's just to be expected. I would be far more impressed to hear about a kid from a blue collar town who got a 1600 on the SAT without taking a prep course, and got into Harvard without having any tutors, coaches, counselors or other special help. (There was a kid from my high school who did it.)

Mattie

--posted by Mattie @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 22:42 pm EDT

Now that MM has been found out, what will we talk about now???

--posted by cretin @ Thursday, July 3 2003, 22:52 pm EDT

Miss H.' talent is natural. She just had it polished by the type of school she attended. One just does not get A's because they are rich and/or beautiful. She had advantages by living in the Moorestown area. She went to an school of over achievers.

Again, Miss Hornstine is physicially disabled, not a fraud. You would not wish her condition on your enemy.

I agree that other deserving students around the country probably did not "play the game" and are not going to Harvard. One of the reasons is money. Harvard does not, itself, give out scholarship money. If a student has not won tremendous amounts of money or have a family willing to foot the bill, he/she doesn't even try to attend Harvard.

The other two students at MHS going to Harvard have parents behind them also. Otherwise, they, too, would not be attending.

All of a class cannot go to an "IVY" or a school of that caliber. Don't forget this type of university wants a high class ranking. So an A student in one school that is as good as an A student in another might not be accepted in the same school based on class ranking.

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Friday, July 4 2003, 0:03 am EDT

MaggotMouth, you've never set foot in Moorestown. So how on earth would you know whether Blair's illness is real or fabricated? ANSWER: You wouldn't.

Since you've never met Blair, how could you know anything about her "talents?" How would you know how smart a complete stranger is? ANSWER: You couldn't possibly be in a position to say anything about Blair's intelligence (or lack thereof).

You also know very little about college admissions. I know that you're only in 10th grade, but you'll have to learn sooner or later. Harvard is no different from any other first-rate school. Many people apply. Few get in. While some "involved" parents might get their kids into top schools, this does not happen very often. Many people go to these schools WITHOUT parents behind them. Have you ever heard of financial aid?

Please stop spreading lies and deceptions. You have been found out. If you don't shape up, you'll end up repeating 9th grade (and NOT at home!)

--posted by cretin @ Friday, July 4 2003, 0:13 am EDT

"One just does not get A's because they are rich and/or beautiful. "

Here you have a point. Being rich in itself did not guarantee Blair high grades. Being privately tutored and graded did. Dropping classes mid-year to continue them at home was what contributed to her high grades. Money was indirectly involved. But it was not necessary.

And while Blair does lack good looks, I think her lack of integrity is a more pressing concern. If she continues to plagiarize, she will soon find herself going to the local community college.

--posted by cretin @ Friday, July 4 2003, 0:20 am EDT

What had been a realitively lively discussion of the merits and pitfalls of this issue has become a name calling, personal attack on Mrs. M.M., and frankly, it's sad to see it being carried out to this point. At various points there have been runs at me, I turn them aside, but at the same time, there have not been runs that include the kind of abuse that Cretin has begun heaping upon Mrs. M.M.

Cretin "believes" that he has found out who Mrs. M.M. is, yet in various posts he has postulated at least three different people, and now is claiming she is in 10th grade.

As I don't know Mrs. M.M., for all I know he could be correct, but I doubt it very seriously. What I do know is that Mrs. M.M. has tried to address various points within the debate, and has done so admirably, and with poise, for the most part. Cretin on the other hand has resorted to profanity, slander, and various other devices of the adament and insecure. He wants so much to have the last word that he's willing to destroy the sense of community that Adam's blog has engendered. How sad for him, that he must resort to verbal violence to make his points.

While I don't disagree with some areas of his rantings, after you get through them to the meat, if you will, he obscures the virtues of any post he makes with repeated offensive and derogatory language, which does prove a couple of things; he has a full grasp of profanity, which certainly must make his parents proud. And, he has learned the art of negative combat, however, he has not learned the almost certain conclusion to such attacks, and that is the general and overt reaction to it, which is to ignore, shun, and devalue what might have actually been worthwhile.

Name calling is what 4 year olds do. How old did you say you were Cretin... graduated in 2001? 20 maybe 21? You have so much to learn, and you won't learn it by running your mouth. If you listen and consider, and think, you may have something worthwhile. It's obvious you're not a dummy, but your presentation is worse than that, it's plain old disqusting.

Learn to have a reasonable debate, or don't, but don't expect anyone to buy into your babble, when you destroy it with profanity and inmaturity.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Friday, July 4 2003, 2:32 am EDT

Everyone:

Please refrain from unnecessary name-calling in future posts. Though feelings are strong on both sides of this issue, we can all endeavor to respect each other by debating the points, not the person.

Of course, if you are purporting to be someone that you are not, well, all bets are off.

-adam

--posted by Adam @ Friday, July 4 2003, 3:01 am EDT

S. Douglas-Smith,

I have discovered that MM is a troll who has never set foot in Moorestown.

A former student died in a car crash, and MM did not know about this. ANYONE living in Moorestown would have known about this.

While MM is free to have opinions on this issue, it is obvious that he is not a resident of Moorestown. Don't believe his information any more than you would believe mine.

--posted by cretin @ Friday, July 4 2003, 10:03 am EDT

"Cretin on the other hand has resorted to profanity, slander, and various other devices of the adament and insecure."

I learned from MM, but now I've learned my lesson!

I'm no troll!

--posted by cretin @ Friday, July 4 2003, 10:04 am EDT

My integrity is not at stake. Thank you to many who see the need to protect it.

I had stated early on when Creaptin started his posts that I had previously read them on other blogs. He has a dislike for the Hornstine family, whether it is personal or because of the Blair situation. No matter to me. The chip on his shoulder got there somehow.

I have never lied as far as I know in my postings. I do live in Moorestown. I do know what is going on. I am not Mrs. Hornstine, etc. I have been to the hearing. I do know the family and ancillary associates very well.

I have only tried to set some of the story "straight."
You all know my personal feelings.

I chose not to answer Creatin any longer last eve as I felt I was just talking to a "troublemaker," further affirmed by his "handle.

Again, thanks S.D-S. My veracity may be at stake with some, but I do find that you and others, while possibly not agreeing with my feelings, acknowledge my truthfulness.

Thanks Adam for putting "most" of us here.

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Friday, July 4 2003, 10:59 am EDT

MaggotMouth,

Give it up! You have been uncovered! At least get a new name like a REAL troll...

And we do know your personal feelings. Plagiarism is OK. You have lost all credibility by defending a plagiarist. You would be better off sticking to the valedictorian issue.

If you ever get around to it, you might want to visit Moorestown. It is a charming little town.

--posted by cretin @ Friday, July 4 2003, 11:07 am EDT

Creaptin: I would almost choose to meet you for coffee on Main Street, if you wouldn't "wet your pants" when you actually saw me.

Because I know you, I feel this ungodly reason to laugh at your insecurities. I promise the rest of you that I will no longer dignify his reponses.

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Friday, July 4 2003, 11:11 am EDT

MaggotMouth,

Trust me, I wouldn't be the one wetting my pants.

And every town has a Main Street. You'll have to do better than that if you want to pretend that you live in Moorestown.

Why are you so insecure? Why do you feel the need to latch onto the Hornstines, people you don't even know? Why do you feel the need to defend plagiarism? Are there some skeletons in your closet?

P.S. If you know me so well, prove it.

--posted by cretin @ Friday, July 4 2003, 11:14 am EDT

I'll make you a deal Cretin: I'll fly both you and Mrs. MM to Colorado and we can all have coffee in Gunnison, on Main Street, which incidently, is one of the only streets in town. After which we'll discuss all of this rationally as we overlook the 3000 foot drop into the Black Canyon of the Gunnison. Later, I'll even show you the incredible sites found in this wonderful state, and show you why it's commonly called "Gods' Playground".

After all that, when we're all happy that we've been introduced, and know who everybody is, I'll put you back on an airplane and send you home, safe and sound, happy in the awareness of finally knowing who is who.

Please note however, that once you arrive in Denver, you'll have to take a commuter flight to Gunnison, or Aspen, and I'll drive over and get you. The mountains don't allow for much larger jets in this area.

Let me know, I'll be happy to arrange it. However, there are some catches. You have to stop with the names, and Mrs. MM also has to agree.

In this fashion you can resolve your differences face to face with a neutral third party. Otherwise, I suggest you take Mrs. MM up on her offer and meet her for coffee on your Main Street, and stop this pointless and ultimately futile bashing party you've got going on.

So, what do you think, Cretin, Mrs. MM?

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Friday, July 4 2003, 12:47 pm EDT

rotflmao!

S. D-S, you have made my day! But please be careful - from what you've seen of me and MM, I don't think you'd want to be caught in the middle of one of our fights!

Plus, I don't think either of us would be able to stop the name-calling long enough to get anywhere.

It was a nice thought, though!

--posted by cretin @ Friday, July 4 2003, 13:11 pm EDT

S.D-S. Thanks for the invitation. I might take you up on the meeting, at least with you. I have so enjoyed your writings, your ability to communicate, your opinions, etc. Your abilities on the prose end certainly exceed mine. It is such a pleasure to read my thoughts when YOU write them.

I will be in Boulder (actually outside) for a wedding NEXT Labor Day weekend. My friend who just moved from Moorestown to Hilton Head, SC has a daughter who is getting married there NEXT year. I might keep your posts and keep in touch. We will have a public answer, actually I already know 90%of the results, to the Blair fiasco. We will be able to discuss it to the end. In addition, I have a son who is a graphic designer. We might have additional topics to discuss. I have traveled extensively, but believe it or not, I have never been to Colorado with the exception of the airport in Denver. I have a child who went for a very, very short time to Colorado State, but it was to brief a time for me to go there.

I have a couple friends who "winter" in either Aspen or Vail. I hear about the beauty and the "shopping" from them so often. My son loves to go to Beckenridge. So...you might be suprised. I might get to meet you.

I am not sure what Creaptin wants except to be heard. If he is who I was informed he is, I am sure I know him and some family. I would gladly meet him on Main Street at the Starbucks. No, every town does not have a Main Street. I have lived in Cherry Hill, Atlantic City area, and other areas in N.J. Of all those towns, only Moorestown has a Main Street, as far as I know. Cambridge, MA, has a Main Street, as does Providence, RI, but Philadelphia, and New Haven, CT do not. I can go on and on. I can name neighbors, streets, etc. in Moorestown. True, I could pull up so much of it on the Internet. So what does it prove? I know what I know. I think I have more accurate information and "missing" information that I have discussed on the Hornstine matter. If anyone chooses to disbelieve me, it is their prerogative. In the meantime, you and I will have some interesting discourse on the matter at hand or whatever.

Thanks for your offer. My summer is so busy. I would love to see Gunnison. With a little bit of luck, I will get there. My best to you.

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Friday, July 4 2003, 13:28 pm EDT

Ad hominem attacks are logically fallacious.

Nice try, though!

If you really knew me, you'd know my name. Come on - hit me with your best shot!

--posted by cretin @ Friday, July 4 2003, 13:43 pm EDT

MaggotMouth, it's kind of funny. You have not set the story straight any more than I have. We both have our own agendas, yet you pretend that yours is somehow more legitimate? I don't think so.

If you really do live in Moorestown, it's interesting that you don't know anything about the town, the students, the parents, or anything.

I'm convinced that you are not a teacher, because you also seem to know next to nothing about college admissions.

I think you either live in a completely different state, or maybe you are BLAIR!?

--posted by cretin @ Friday, July 4 2003, 13:50 pm EDT

Well, it was a thought...

Starbucks! (Insert stunned emoticon here). We have a Molly's Coffee and Beer, is that close enough? You have to go to Apen or Vail for a Starbucks around here, and I love my coffee, (even have Kona flown in from Hawaii), but I'm not driving for 3 flippen hours for a cup, unless, you two relent and take me up on my offer, then, heck, I can point out all the interesting geological formations on the way.

I want to point out a couple of things: 152.163.252.162 is the IP Address of Mrs. MM from Adam wayyyyyyyyyyyy back up there when he thought, (maybe still does) that several posters were actually posting from one location. A trace route on that IP address resolves to an AOL Server on the East Coast, specifically cache-RH02.proxy.aol.com an AOL server in Philly. Traveling through VA. to an AOL Transit Data Network ATDN. This is a broad band server that services the NJ area, Delaware, and parts of PA, North East Va, and Maryland. You can conduct a traceroute of this or any IP at http://visualroute.visualware.com/ and by entering the IP location you want to trace.

This is not an infallible test. Should anyone conduct a route trace on my IP, it resolves back to a Time Warner Broad Band Server in Cincinatti, Ohio. Of course I'm in Colorado so how is this possible? Simple, I use a satellite uplink from my home via DirectWay to link directly to my business servers in Ohio because that is where the company was founded. Because I use a ported address to my business, it appears that my souce is actually in Ohio. Since satellite broadband is in fact a wireless connection, the original hardwired server that it orginates from is in Ohio, and not in Colorado. What this means, is that while not many people have such connections, the fact of the matter is that it is possible to generally trace the location of a poster.

Given that Mrs. MM's IP is in the general vicinity of Moorestown it is likely that she is from that area. There are methods and expensive software that will resolve a host down to a local system, however firewalls and other protection software, and hardware make it difficult to finally resolve the location of a poster based on the IP address alone.

This information does however, partially invalidate Cretin's claim that Mrs. MM is from some other area, and it also tends to validate her claim that she is from Moorestown, or at least the general vicinity.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Friday, July 4 2003, 16:16 pm EDT

For someone who claims to know so much about the students at MHS, it is quite interesting that MaggotMouth did NOT know about the death of one such student.

MaggotMouth, if you're really from Moorestown, prove it. Answer these questions:

1. What was in the building that currently houses the Starbucks BEFORE it was a Starbucks?

2. Where is the best place to get a beer in Moorestown?

3. What is your favorite mall?

4. What is my name?

--posted by cretin @ Friday, July 4 2003, 17:03 pm EDT

Blair was not valedictorian because she did not give the valedictory address at graduation.

--posted by cretin @ Friday, July 4 2003, 17:04 pm EDT

When I was at MHS, taxpayers did not fund private tutors for me. I was subject to scheduling constraints when choosing my courses, and I was not allowed to drop classes in which I would have earned a lower grade than I would have liked.

This is clearly discrimination based on disability status. Isn't that illegal?

--posted by cretin @ Friday, July 4 2003, 17:06 pm EDT

I am almost computer illiterate, when it comes to IP, etc. I am where I say I am. I have a dish, a cable and am hooked up through my husband's business. He has businesses in several states, headquartered locally. I did not know what an IP was until a few days ago. You can look me up, get my name, addresss, etc. Hey, I can't believe I have to defend myself. Anyway, whatever, I know what I know and I am where I say.

S.D-S. Please don't get me into another spitting contest with the above posting individual. You and I have been at this for a couple weeks. All of a sudden, some ************************* is questioning me. I have my own ways to deal with him outside of this forum. If you want me to continue posting with you, please let's go on and leave the shenanigans and semantics to others.

I am off to dinner in town(downtown Philly). IF I name the restaurant will it satisfy anyone???? Ha Ha.
Then to watch the fireworks. You know we are living in the cradle of liberty. It's not Colorado, but... So Happy Birthday, USA.
Be thankful for what we have.

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Friday, July 4 2003, 17:17 pm EDT

Haha, I see I called YOUR bluff.

Better luck next time.

--posted by cretin @ Friday, July 4 2003, 17:26 pm EDT

Okay, smarta**: I will shut you up once and for all: Don't bother me again.

1. Wright's Hardware Store

2. Don't drink beer; buy my wine At Martin's on Rt. 38

3. Prefer Cherry Hill Mall to Moorestown Mall. Used to shop more at Moorestown Mall when Wanamaker's and Gimbel's were there....But my real preference for the area, but it takes me almots an hour is King of Prussia Mall.

4. Your name. I will not reveal what I think at the moment. #1 I am not 100% positive; #2, this isn't the place for someone else to reveal your name.

Furthermore, I still like to get my ice cream (Choc. Almond ) at Friendly's. This is the only one in the area and for maybe 100's of miles. I like to buy my fresh fruit and producr at the Flying Feather (can't find that on the internet).

I used to like to take the kids to Strawbridge Lake to see the ducks. In those days, it was soooo clean.

We eat in Passierello's once in a while. How about you?

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Friday, July 4 2003, 17:58 pm EDT

There is another Friendly's on Rt. 130. And another in Marlton, near the circle.

Give me the intials of who you think I am. This should be amusing.

--posted by cretin @ Friday, July 4 2003, 20:36 pm EDT

I have to wonder how long it will take for this to die down. It has certainly become a shouting down blog for Cretin. Enough is enough, really! You have totally usurped the very point of this site, and made it into your personal playpen. Change your darn diaper, son.

Mrs. MM, for the record, I posted the IP info to hopefully slow down Cretin. He continues to prove himself to be about half witted and completely pointless.

Cretin, this is not about you, or what you want to scream. If you like screaming, then try scream therapy, I hear it works wonders. As for your continued assault on this blog, and your completely pointless postings, frankly, I'd rather hear about the grass growing.

You're obviously spoiled, and without any socially redeeming values that would even make me want to continue trying to get you to get on the topic, and off the personal attacks. Even the owner of the site has repeatedly admonished posters, in general, to get back on topic.

If it were up to me, I would ban your IP so that you can not post, but it isn't. I defended a religiously motivated poster, though I completely disagree with him, because of the appearance of censorship, however, it is one thing to defend that, particularlly when it was ONE post. You on the other hand, simply won't stop until you are forced to stop. In business, and in a survival situation that may be a good thing, but in conversation it's a waste of everyone's time, effort, and intellect.

You haven't proved anything, except that you're relentless. You haven't gained anything except a full compliment of people who cringe when you post something, and you haven't earned an iota of respect for the position you've adopted. You even debate factual information, and when you're done ignoring the truth, you go on witch hunts...

Look in the mirror, Cretin, the witch is there. Think The Wizard of Oz, and put your anger behind you, so you can join us in a chorus of "Ding Dong, The Witch is Dead". Either that, or just go away, you're angst is now old and pointless, and to be honest, I think you just got your a** whipped by a resident of Moorestown. How much more are you willing to get wrong in order to scream last?

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Friday, July 4 2003, 20:37 pm EDT

OMG, you're should be "you", I wish that firecracker hadn't startled me.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Friday, July 4 2003, 20:43 pm EDT

Ad hominem attacks are logically fallacious. They do nothing to advance your arguments. Try moving forward in your arguments, not backwards.

And when was my ass been whipped? MaggotMouth and I are have different OPINIONS on an issue. At least I don't hide behind a cloak of objectivity.

And I'm still wondering why MM didn't know about that boy's death. I wasn't even his friend, and I knew about it.

Even if MM does live in Moorestown, he has shown repeatedly that he knows very little about the students. Please do your research on the issue instead of pretending that your opinions are facts.

--posted by cretin @ Friday, July 4 2003, 20:46 pm EDT

Read this blog. At no time did she say she didn't. She asked if you ran in the same 'unsocial' circles as a "last name" did. You presumed she didn't know about a death, she has never said anything about it, and you presumed she wasn't aware, and you presumed you had some information, that you don't.

Where did you get your favorite quote? Can you define the words in it? Why don't you. The issue is the Hornstine situation, not how many names you can call people. Do your research, and check your facts, because so far, she's kicking your a** dude, and everyone can see it, except you.

That's typically the same thing that happens to children that have temper tantrums.

I'm not hiding behind anything, objectively is how I look at things, there is no cloak about it.

I live in a town that's full of all of oh, 2500 people, and I don't know one damn student that goes to school here, nor do I care to. My point is simple, why does she have to know about the students, does Moorestown revolve around them?

Now, when the College is in session, I know a couple of students, because they rent rooms from me, but other than that, I could care less, because other than the taxes I pay, I have nothing to do with the school system here. There is one in Oklahoma that I have a great deal to do with, and I know the names of most of the students there.

All of which has nothing to do with Blair Hornstine, the Law Suit, the reaction, and the fall out.

Much the same way your posts have nothing to do with it. Get the picture?

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 0:34 am EDT

I was referring to ERIC Bitner, not David. Do we have to discuss another graduate who died because of his involvment of drugs?

I did forget about the other two Friendly's. The one on Main street was there for so long and was the only one in South Jersey and possibly in New Jersey about 15 years ago. Yes, I stop in the Friendly's at the 70/73 circle often when I go to the book store across the street near Olga's Diner.

Creaptin, I don't care who you think I am. You decided that I was Rowe and then Izzo. Your prior quotes follow. Then you decided that I didn't know the Hornstines or live in Moorestown.

"So Mrs. Rowe, how did you become so friendly with the family?"
"My bet is now on Izzo"

I think you have a chip on your shoulder when it comes to the Hornstines. I think you are anti-semitic.

I KNOW THE FACTS. THERE IS NO DOUBT. "Hiding behind" being independent in my thoughts or reality ? I do have opinions on some of the varying extemporaneous thoughts passed on by others here. When it comes to knowing the facts, I am 99%++ correct. Whether you believe or not, it is your preogative. I was discussing the issues until you raised your ugly head. You have learned two words in your life and think they are going to make you a "big man". Ad hominem and Cretin. Please increase your vocabulary. You had a better education than that. Are you presently enrolled in college? I think you should be. Put your anger, jealousy and anti-semitism behind you and listen to S. Douglas-Smith. I know you don't want to or will take my advise. He has some strong feelings about you and advice about the direction you should proceed with your life. He is an extremely bright man who knows how to pull himself up from the bootstraps. Live and learn. Get a life! Grow up! Change your attitude!

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 0:58 am EDT

Mrs. M.M. - you stated above - "Harvard does not, itself, give out scholarship money. If a student has not won tremendous amounts of money or have a family willing to foot the bill, he/she doesn't even try to attend Harvard. " Very wrong!

I went to Harvard and received financial aid. About 70% of Harvard students receive financial aid. Even families with annual incomes exceeding $100,000 qualify for scholarship aid (from: http://www.college.harvard.edu/admissions/financial_faqs.html#1).

--posted by cambridgema @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 10:56 am EDT

Cambridgema

I have not been able to find the newspaper article stating that the Courier Post requires (requests?) that writers acknowledge in writing that the work they submit is their own. I checked online versions of the Burlington County Times and other papers where articles have appeared. I feel pretty confident that I read about a policy in a newspaper but unless I can produce it, I too question relying on this piece of information. I am not sure the online versions are complete and although I don't agree with much that has been said on this bog, I do know that newspapers are not infallible. Even if someone contacted the Courier and inquired about their policies, we would not know whether the paper required Blair Hornstine to sign this policy. Wonder if they would discuss this? I agree with you that whether or not there is such a policy does not excuse the plagiarism but it does add something to the facts.

--posted by DM @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 11:18 am EDT

Ad hominem attacks are logically fallacious. Please rephrase your arguments in a logically valid manner!

MaggotMouth, you're getting YOUR ass whipped! Not only are you racist, but you refuse to realize it.

I don't care who S. Douglas-Smith-Jones is.

I am an extremely bright man who knows how to pull myself up from the bootstraps. Live and learn. Get a life! Grow up! Change your attitude!

--posted by cretin @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 11:23 am EDT

Disliking the Hornstines makes me anti-semitic? Logically fallacious, yet again. With that logic, you too are racist, since you have attacked me.

May I suggest night school? Get your GED, and then take some courses at BCC. It would do you a lot of good.

And please don't bring up how many "facts" you know. Based on your posts here, it seems that you don't know anything. You have expressed many opinions, but so far no facts.

Look in the mirror, MaggotMouth, the witch is there. Think The Wizard of Oz, and put your anger behind you, so you can join us in a chorus of "Ding Dong, The Witch is Dead". Either that, or just go away, you're angst is now old and pointless, and to be honest, I think you just got your ass whipped by a resident of Moorestown. How much more are you willing to get wrong in order to scream last?

--posted by cretin @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 11:54 am EDT

Given the fact that Blair plagiarized in at least 5 instances (http://www.courierpostonline.com/static/st060303g.html) I have to wonder if she plagiarized in her schoolwork. After all, if she felt that she could "get away" with presenting others' words as her own in such a public forum (i.e. a newspaper read by many), what is the likelihood that she might have behaved in a similar fashion when writing a term paper - for an audience of one (and, hence, subject to far less scrutiny)?

--posted by cambridgema @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 11:56 am EDT

Everyone:

Spend a day away from the computer and look what happens to this comments section!

This discussion has degenerated into a broken record of personal attacks. Please reduce such chatter, or I will block IP addresses and/or end comments on this page.

The next steps for this page includes creating a table of facts, rumors, and lies, based on all of the information available on the Internet and from this comments board. This will help us understand that the issue is more varied than simple black and white.

-adam

--posted by Adam @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 14:54 pm EDT

Cretin is a plagiarist.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 14:59 pm EDT

Cambridgema: I have it on indisputable information that Blair's works in school and her essays/writings for the scholarships she won were gone over in painstaking detail. There was not one iota of evidence in these works that they were not COMPLETELY hers, ie. no plagiarism found. I think that one of the newspaper stories verifies this, however, since many articles in the news are incorrect, I can not accept any article as being objective or truthful.

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 16:10 pm EDT

Cambridgema: To my knowledge, the Courier Post NEVER suggested that BLAIR signed any work of hers and/or any statement "saying she would only submit original works." It has been suggested that the Courier Post had and has such a policy. This newspaper NEVER said she was given this paper or had signed same. The Courier Post "supposedly" has a "booklet" of ethics and instructions again, supposedly, given to all employees. The newspaper has never publically announced that Ms. H. received such booklet. Her attorneys and family deny she received such booklet or statement of originality to sign. The newspaper has NEVER disputed this.

Many posts, various columnists, etc. have suggested or stated that those items were supplied to Miss H. when she began her "writing career" with the Courier Post. The Courier Post has never verified that or, to my knowledge, publicly endorsed these statements.

My Opionion for what its worth: Although there is no doubt that Miss H has plagiarized in articles for the Courier Post and "discovered by an Aunt of the Board of Education Lawyer," the Courier bit off a little too much when they got into this fray. I just wonder out loud if the veracity of the Courier is now at stake or if ( and that is a large, large IF), they could have legal trouble over this. I know about the First Amendment rights, but I do not know about the rights of an employee/contributor/ etc. if full policies are not properly given to employee. I also know PLAGIARISM IS PLAGIARISM. As I said, I just wonder outloud, why the Courier did not publish the information about Blair receiving and/or not receiving this paperwork.

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 16:31 pm EDT

VERY IMMATURE

--posted by tg @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 16:41 pm EDT

It is clear and simple fact that Blair plagiarized in her newspaper stories.

As for the review of her schoolwork ... does the school keep copies of all of her essays and term papers for four years? I know of no school that does. An assignment is completed, handed in, graded and handed back to the student. If there does exist an archive of the 4 years of all of her writings, I’d suggest that it put before an independent third-party for review.

[BTW – I personally think that it is highly unlikely that any such review is possible…unless Blair kept all of her past assignments and is willing to hand them over - unadulterated].

Mrs. MM - by all means please provide us with the "indisputable information that Blair's works in school and her essays/writings for the scholarships she won were gone over in painstaking detail." I'd welcome a pointer to the source and corresponding evidence.

Didn’t I read in a press report that while Blair’s attorney claimed that the school had reviewed her work, the school itself refuted his claim and stated officially that no such activity had/has occurred?

What a “zinger” it would be, if by chance her application essay to Harvard contained “lifted words”.

--posted by cambridgema @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 17:07 pm EDT

"That makes us really curious about the essays Hornstine wrote as a student, the ones that presumably contributed to the grades that made her valedictorian. If, as Hornstine now alibis, she's a victim of careless computer cutting-and-pasting from the Internet, are we to believe she was utterly scrupulous in her school work?" (From - "http://www.kentucky.com/mld/dailynews/6026198.htm)

My sentiments - exactly.

--posted by cambridgema @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 17:51 pm EDT

An interesting accounting from one of Blair's neighbors, posted at: http://www.unlearnedhand.com/archives/000305.html.

--posted by cambridgema @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 17:55 pm EDT

It would be a zinger!!!

I cannot provide you with the "indisputable info" that you require. It is not a written piece of info. It is something that I have from a solid source. I, too, do not understand how ALL four years of work was reviewed. Certain papers, etc. are computer generated or saved.

Why does a third party have to review them? To make some posters happy? Do you really think that by having an independent review of her schoolwork, the world would be satisfied that she won the Valedictory role fairly and squarely? There are those who will always challenge it because of her illness, tutors, Father, etc. The facts are that she earned her Valedictory role from the school.There was never a question or a hint of plagiarism in the court case or by the school prior to them losing the legal battle. The school could have appealed the case. The BOE had EVERY legal right to do so. The school COULD have appealed and brought up plagiarism, if it effected her winning the Valedictorian role. The school was knocked down, trampled on and buried with its lies and non-facts. She DID plagiarise in articles in the Courier Post. The newspaper articles, to many, set the tone for those who were not supporters in the Valedictorian case in the first place to further find fault. Most people who don't support her are looking for more stones to throw, more fodder to examine and more reasons to "hate" her.

The Courier Post articles have nothing to do with her school work, scholarships and admittance to college.

As far as the press report about reviewing her work, again, I find a couple articles (keep searching) where one article disputes the other. I think that "someone" took Harvard's statements and credited it to Moorestown or vice versa. I have learned in this case that the newspapers are soooo void of facts; often, they think they are tabloids and want "zinger" headlines. I sat next to a reporter at the hearing. We discussed the case when the Judge was out rendering her opinion and continued after court was adjourned. She took copious notes; we agreed on what the Judge said and how the case went. I read her article the next day. She left out the "positive items" and the schools chastisment. She only wrote the "rousing" words.

As S. Douglass-Smith (June 28, 2003 17:58 p.m.) noted in his moving thoughts in response to the article from Jonathan Last " ...It's like this, Mr. Last gave all the Kadri LIES about Mr. Hornstine a total of 9 paragraphs in his little missive, alternately playing the sympathy game, and then snatching away the prize, while burying the damning truth in a one paragraph, disjointed sentence which exposes Mr. Kari’s lies for what they were. Typical bore you with bull and then drop the bomb, by the time you get there; you're too tired to pay attention."

If you haven't read Mr. Douglass-Smith's above contribution to this blog, do so.

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 18:00 pm EDT

Some very interesting points from CNN transcripts of legal correspondent Jeffrey Toobin (http://www.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0305/08/ltm.10.html)

May 8, 2003

“Let's talk about some of the reasons why I think this story is ridiculous. First, don't make a federal case out of it. It's what parents teach their kids about all sorts of things. This is simply not a justified use of the federal court's limited time and resources. Second, no damages. What did she suffer here? She's the co- valedictorian. It is simply not something that the legal system should address, much less $2.7 million in punitive damages….And third, lack of gratitude. This school district, the taxpayers of this school district paid to have tutors sent to this girl's home, because she has a disability, which she's entitled to do, but it was a very expensive project for the school district. She shouldn't be suing...”

“This lawsuit is brought under a slightly different law [than the ADA, American With Disabilities Act], but it's the same principle. She's claiming that she's discriminated against because she's disabled. And I think it trivializes the very valuable Americans With Disabilities Act and that whole principle, because this is not what it's about. It's about keeping people out of jobs, it's about depriving people of money damages. I mean, that's the kind of thing the ADA was passed to correct. This is trivia and nonsense and it should be thrown out.”

“Her father is a state court judge….You know, all of us who are lawyers, we risk inflicting it on our children, and I'm afraid it's happened here.”

“She's going to my alma mater, and God bless her. And I think she'll be fine, but she ought to do her lessons in school, not in court.”

--posted by cambridgema @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 18:06 pm EDT

Ms M.M. - I am not contesting – and never have contested – Blair’s status as Valedictorian. You are right in pointing out that her plagiarism in her newspaper articles is not relevant to her schoolwork, etc. I do have to question, though, whether or not Blair was “lax” in citing sources – or, intentionally plagiarized- in her schoolwork. If so, then her academic achievements can be viewed in retrospect with warranted skepticism.

If a review of her past work was indeed possible, I merely suggest that a “third-party” with no bias, agenda or “emotional attachment” to the situation would be the best way to proceed.

BTW – I have been reading Douglass-Smith’s postings – as you’ll note we have actually had some fruitful conversation about each other’s postings.

--posted by cambridgema @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 18:22 pm EDT

Do you really believe the posting from the Unlearned Hand from Blair's neighbor? PLEEEEEASE!!!! If you think her Mother called in her grades? PLEEEASE! If you think that the BOE for four years with four years of doctor's opinions approved her IEP because she was a "cry baby"...." PLEEEEASE! Do you really believe that the BOE and the MHS gave her this "disability" so that her parents would have control of her grades? PLEEEEASE! So she goes to Curves for 1/2 hour a week or so with her Mother...so she doesn't have any friends, so? No one said she was completely bedridden!
No one said she couldn't talk on the phone, eat, take a walk, watch TV, see a movie, etc. No one said she had to have "friends" to walk with in the neighborhood. Because she "walked" with her Father, does that make him the controller of her life? Maybe they have a great relationship. She certainly is not hiding in the house. She tries to add some normalacy to her life. Is there an odor coming around the corner???? Did someone's dog make a do in someone's yard?
By the way, this Moorestown Mom is NOT me!!

I attach the response to this "neighbor" from another enlightened individual.
"Moorestown Mom: Is the DEGREE of disability an issue? Do you really know the nature of this girl's illness? The school board is at fault if there is a question of the validity of her disability and your complaint should be with them.
You come across as someone quite jealous of the benefits others have in life; get over it! If she did not come from a wealthy family and she had a mesh cage in her ribs, I doubt most of you would have a problem with this!"

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 18:23 pm EDT

Ms M.M. – I merely stated above that there was an interesting account online from one of Blair’s neighbors. I didn’t say I believe any of it. Just another person who is closer to the situation than most of those who are posting here. It’s interesting to hear some counter-balance and different perspectives. We have your point-of-view and others from Moorestown on this blog. I seek other accountings of the situation, as well. It's difficult to sort through the perspectives of those who claim "first-hand" and as you put it, "indisuptable" knowledge of the Hornstine family, etc.

--posted by cambridgema @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 18:31 pm EDT

Cambridgema: I somewhat agree with Jeffrey Tobin. He is a very astute man. BUT, what he and so many others failed to realize from getting their stories off the AP, etc. was that BLAIR HORNSTINE WAS NEVER OFFERED OR GOING TO BE OFFERED A CO-VAEDICTORIANSHIP. The superintendent in no way wanted her to share or have this honor. The AP and many news writers failed to get the entire story. Is their lack of omission the same as lying? As bad as plagiarism? These people are professionals. I find it difficult to read many items in the news. How about Pfc. Lynch? The drama of the story sells papers. I feel that the drama of "disabled, well-to-do, home schooled, Harvard bound student not accepting Co-Valedictorian" falls in the same line. Please again read Judge Wolfson's hearing verdict or obtain the transcript.

I do believe Blair was "lax" or (and I find it hard to say) "didn't know better." I know Blair. Blair would not have in any way jeopardized what she had worked so hard for in school by plagiarizing. If anyone can show me where she plagiarized in school, I will eat my words. I know that is almost an empty promise, because I do not think the public will ever get to see any school paperwork. I would stake my reputation and whatever on her honesty. As far as the Courier stories???? I can't for the life of me suggest any reason that she plagiarized except for this laxity or stupidity. I know most don't want to believe it, but sometimes it is the simple things in life.....

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 18:38 pm EDT

Cambridgema: I am curious about the disabled neighbor. I am going to do some investigating. It will satisy my curiosity also. If I have any further info on "her," I will advise. I don't know why, but...

Could she be the Mother of another poster from this site? I doubt it, but one might find out.

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 18:42 pm EDT

What I take away from Jeffrey Toobin's comments is a general distaste by some for the heavy-handed nature and "misuse" of the court system to rectify the situation in Moorestown. I agree with him that the lesson and example set by this whole affair is unfortunate - and to me - unseemly (including the pursuit of financial damages).

--posted by cambridgema @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 18:46 pm EDT

Mrs. MM:

>Cambridgema: I somewhat agree with Jeffrey Tobin. He is a
>very astute man. BUT, what he and so many others failed to
>realize from getting their stories off the AP, etc. was that BLAIR
>HORNSTINE WAS NEVER OFFERED OR GOING TO BE OFFERED A
>CO-VAEDICTORIANSHIP. The superintendent in no way wanted >her to share or have this honor. The AP and many news writers

You are making this assumption based on two facts:

1. Letter to K. Mirkin stating that he would be considered to be valedictorian.
2. Proposed ammendment to school rules to allow for multiple valedictorians.

From these two facts, a person can derive two assumptions:

1. Awarding of multiple valedictorians (i.e. K. Mirkin and Hornstine)
2. Awarding of valedictorian to another student in place of another student (i.e. Mirkin instead of Hornstine).

Wolfson's verdict does not say that Kadri was going to name Mirkin the sole valedictorian.

Please do not put as fact what is a personal opinion and assumption.

-adam

--posted by Adam @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 18:58 pm EDT

Adam: With all due respect to you. At the hearing, and [I WAS THERE], Judge Wolfson asked the attorney for the BOE, if they would at that time say that they, (the BOE), would name Blair Hornstine a co Valedictorian. The attorney was PRESSED over and over by the Judge (don't forget, she would have probably dropped the suit) to answer this question. The attorney, with the President of the BOE and Kenny Mirkin's Mother and attorney sitting next to him would not state that Blair would become a, an, etc. Valedictorian. The Judge asked over and over, so many times that it brought a chuckle from the audience as the attorney stumbled and beat around the bush. He finally said NO. (The transcript will verify my comments.)

In the Judge's decision, which I quote "Worse yet, the fact that Kadri informed K.M._and not plaintiff_that he was being considered for the award raises the possibility that the Board may not select plaintiff for the honor at all. Indeed, the proposed policy amendment is vague enough to allow the Board to avoid naming the student with the highest seventh semester weighted G.P.A. as one of the valedictorians. Perhaps with this possibility in mind, defense counsel at oral argument did not state on the record that the Board definitely would name plaintiff one of the valedictorians."

I KNOW THAT THIS IS FACT; NOT OPINION. YOU CAN READ IT ANYWAY YOU CHOOSE. IT IS FACT. PLEASE DO NOT
ATTEMPT TO BELITTLE ME BECAUSE IT IS NOT YOUR BELIEF.
The hearing would have been over quite quickly, if the Board agreed to select Blair as a co-valedictorian.
If you truly think that after months of negotiations, Blair would have not settled for co-valedictorian, you have your thinking cap on backwards. TAKE IT AS YOU WISH, BUT IT IS AN ACTUAL, TRUE AND CORRECT FACT! You have the preogative of removing my post, but you cannot remove the truth in this situation.

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 19:33 pm EDT

Mrs. MM

While you are investigating the neighbor, why not call members of the school board and ask them whether they thought the issue was one of co-valedictory or rather, an intent to exclude Ms. Hornstine. Perhaps the letter stating he was being considered for valedictorian was sent to Mr. Mirkin so he would have standing to intervene in the TRO. Adam does not agree with your reading of this aspect of the case and neither do I. I really think the letter to Mirkin on which you rest a part of your argument had a different purpose.

--posted by DM @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 19:54 pm EDT

You're entitled.

In about 10 years, after Miss H. gets her money from the BOE, her law degree, the book is written, the movie film is shown, please get back to me. Yep, thi sis all happening. Put this in your tinkler file for year 2013. Let's see who right I am.

--posted by Mrs. M.M. @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 20:19 pm EDT

last sentence should read:

LET'S SEE HOW RIGHT I AM.

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 20:20 pm EDT

Once again, MM bombards us with opinions. Where's the beef? I'm tired of hearing your opinions. You are a nobody. Your opinion doesn't matter any more than mine does.

Let's see how right I am. You cannot remove the truth in this situation.

--posted by cretin @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 22:25 pm EDT

For TG:

Look in the mirror, Cretin, the witch is there. Think The Wizard of Oz, and put your anger behind you, so you can join us in a chorus of "Ding Dong, The Witch is Dead". Either that, or just go away, you're angst is now old and pointless, and to be honest, I think you just got your a** whipped by a resident of Moorestown. How much more are you willing to get wrong in order to scream last?

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Friday, July 4 2003, 20:37 pm EDT

Look in the mirror, MaggotMouth, the witch is there. Think The Wizard of Oz, and put your anger behind you, so you can join us in a chorus of "Ding Dong, The Witch is Dead". Either that, or just go away, you're angst is now old and pointless, and to be honest, I think you just got your ass whipped by a resident of Moorestown. How much more are you willing to get wrong in order to scream last?

--posted by cretin @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 11:54 am EDT

As I said, Cretin is a plagiarist. He has spent so much time trying to rip, hurt, insult, or in general disrupt this board, I felt it only fair to point this out. He is exactly what he claims Blair is, and while there is a general consensus that Blair did indeed plagiarize in the Courier Post, we have also generally agreed that it has no bearing on her status as Valedictorian, although it could affect her admission to Harvard.

Cretin is a lot of things, an original thinker isn't one of them. His 'theft' of my words is obvious, in fact he only changed a name, from Cretin, to "MaggotMouth", and made no other changes to MY material. Cretin is guilty of plagiarism. Is that worth 2.7 million, I dunno, but maybe I'll try and find out, since it seems that's the answer these days. I call a spade a spade, if that's immature, then sue me, and I'll be the oldest kid on the playground.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 22:50 pm EDT

Well, he did spell ass, instead of my less detracting a**, but the point is the same.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 22:51 pm EDT

Since there was no place for footnotes, I did not plagiarize.

--posted by cretin @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 23:17 pm EDT

Douglass-Smith-Jones has spent so much time trying to rip, hurt, insult, or in general disrupt this board. Now I am calling a spade a spade.

--posted by cretin @ Saturday, July 5 2003, 23:19 pm EDT

FROM #2 pencil -
I went to Ms. Hornstine's high school, and I am familiar with her family. They are manipulative, conniving theives. Stay away from them!
Cretin | 05.10.03 - 8:37 pm | #

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God, Blair gives Jews a bad name. Just to let you guys know, we're NOT all like her!!!

Let's hope Mirkin's suit is successful...

And seniors: don't be afraid to walk out of graduation if Blair is well enough to attend! That'll show her.
Cretin | 05.12.03 - 12:48 am | #

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Amazing. She is so twisted that she sued to be the sole valedictorian, knowing full well that she wouldn't be "well enough" to attend graduation!?!? Wow. Isn't the whole point of being valedictorian to make your silly speech at graduation? No one in the real world cares what your class rank was.
Cretin | 05.12.03 - 3:11 am | #

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From Unlearned Hand -
OK, I went to Ms. Hornstine's high school. Thank god I'm out of there now. Anyway, I am familiar with the antics of this family. Ms. Hornstine's "illness" is quite a convenient invention. She was able to study at home and be graded by "tutors." With the help of her father, she was able to choose who would grade her essays and which activities to join to ensure her spot at Harvard. She is following in her brother's footsteps by pretending to care of the community, all the while manipulating the system to her benefit.

As much as I hated that high school and was glad to be rid of the teacher and administrators there, I must say that I would have hated it even more if I had attended while Blair was there.

She has played the system well. Let's see how she fares when she is forced to be with people who can play it even better than she has.

Posted by: cretin at May 10, 2003 08:28 PM

Blair owes US an apology for costing the school district (i.e. US) so much money.

Are you Blair, by the way? You sound like her, except for the fact the you haven't burst into tears yet.

Was Blair's A+ phys ed grade factored into her GPA? If not, it should be.

Do you deny that daddy instructed her tutors to give her A+'s?

Do you deny that the grading standards are different?

Do you have proof that her "disability" even exists?

The fact of the matter is that her grades starting slipping during sophomore year, so daddy realized that his daughter's interests would be better served if she got to study at home.

Daddy is a very influential man. It's no secret how Blair got all those A+'s.

Posted by: cretin at May 11, 2003 04:12 PM

From Hit and Run -
I graduated from Moorestown High in 2001. I can assure you that all the awful things that people are saying about Ms. Hornstine are TRUE. I wouldn't put anything past her and her family.

Posted by: cretin on May 12, 2003 01:25 AM

For all of you that read Cretin....is there a common thread of hate and sham authority that goes through his comments? He hated High school, hates the Hornstine Family and the Father (problems? Up before him in Court?), gives advise to the senior class to walk out (troublemaker?), uses STRONG words like ASSURE, FAMILIAR,MANIPULATIVE, CONNIVING,THEIVES (his spelling) and TWISTED. WHAT IS HE MISSING BESIDES A LIFE?

Now, we are subjected to more of him on this blog. This blog used to be interesting.

--posted by H @ Sunday, July 6 2003, 0:33 am EDT

A hearty round of applause to "H"! Here, here! I totally and heartily concure!

Cretin,

Attibution is the primary redoubt of plagiarism. To properly attribute something within an article may be accomplished by noting prior to or directly after a quote, alliteration, or paraphrase, the original author of such information, or quote. Failure to do is plagiarism as surely as if you took the quote in it's entirity without providing a method to verify and document the contributor.

Since there is no place for footnotes, attribution should have been used to prevent the charge of plagiarism, and the discovery of such lacking, especially in the light of this debate, it's myrid turns, and diverse expressions of opinion should not only have taught you that, but should have branded it on your forehead, (for lack of a better more deserving spot upon your body).

That you use, what is to your discredit, poor humor, name calling, and poorly developed alliteration in your writing, serves as a fine example of your lack of the following life lessons: Integrity, making fun of, debasing, pointless attacking someone or something because you disagree with them, or it, shows a lack of integrity, and humility. (Which would be your second life lesson)

Principle: Your failure to justify your remarks with either well thought out opinions or actual facts, while at the same time, loudly deriding the actual facts of the matter show an inability to grasp the foundation of principle, and how the use of principle in your life can lead to rewards beyond your feeble imaginations' ability to produce.

Ethics: Your repeated "word attacks" Name calling and vulgarity display an obviously discordant grasp of "life" ethics, and an even greater disdain for those who disagree with you. Your actions are childish, pointless, and will ultimately serve to either cause the owner of this blog to close it, or in the very least, begin to censor what is posted due to your inability to properly, and respectfully address the persons who view these posts.

Which leads me to the final life lesson I doubt you've learned, which is respect: Diverse opinions, and diverse differences of opinions is what makes this country, in spite of it's downfalls, a great place to live, and grow old in. Respect for indivdual opinions in the face of overwhelming public support for a differnt opinon, (See Judge Wolfson's ruling for a lesson in this area). Respect for the individual right to do, or to be different things, and respect of the basic human rights of dignity, and harmony. Your disruption of this blog is a sign of disrespect to not only every one who reads it, but also of the owner, and those who post here. That you feel you have the right, (perhaps under the first amendment) to use any vulgarity, or any insult you choose, shows that your level of maturity may not be a match to your level of intelligence, which is sometimes displayed. However, your inability to argue in a respectful fashion logically, and rightfully, lowers the level of respect you will recieve in return for your rantings. Ultimately, the end result is a loss of esteem, and a lack of credibility that can not be over-ridden with apologies, or silence.

Much the same way Blair did when she plagiarized in the Courier Post, you have done more damage to the validity of your claims by your inability to humblely state them, and refusal to respect those around you and their divergent opinions.

Regardless of the self satifaction you gain, sitting there alone, and viewing all the boards you have posted to, ultimately, you are still... alone.

How sad for you.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Sunday, July 6 2003, 1:22 am EDT

As I see it

The Moorestown School Board is bound by law to school all educable children starting at 5 or 6 years old. They augment the state rules with they own and produce regulations and standards for the students and parents to follow and print these regulations for distribution to the students. In addition they buy or rent school buildings, hire teachers and associate personnel, buy books, and form a cirriculum - all with taxpayers' money.

Some of these children because of mental or other handicaps never go to the neighborhood school building. Others go to "special classes" in this school. Some are schooled in other venues. Many are allowed at some point to become regular students. The school district pays for the disabled students who must be educated in special schools; they bus them or give them refunds of bus money. EVEN THE STUDENTS WHO CHOOSE TO GO TO PRIVATE SCHOOLS SUCH AS MOORESTOWN FRIENDS ARE EITHER BUSED TO THAT SCHOOL OR RECEIVE A REFUND OF THE PRIVATE SCHOOL BUS MONEY.

The Board of Education is the responsible party to follow the laws and is answerable to the electorate of the township with their rules and conduct.

The Board of Education and/or the school administrators whom the board hired, review procedures, doctors statements, requests from parents, school bus vouchers, etc. They make the decisions to accept the recommendations to school "special" students.

Therefore, THE BOARD OF EDUCATION ACCEPTED THE DOCTORS' STATEMENTS IN REFERENCE TO BLAIR HORNSTINE. THE BOARD OF EDUCATION ALLOWED HER TO HAVE SPECIAL SCHOOLING FOR FOUR YEARS. THE HORNSTINE FAMILY FOLLOWED PROGRAM THE BOARD SET FOR THEM. THE BOARD OF EDUCATION CREATED THIS SITUATION. THE BOARD OF EDUCATION IS RESPONSIBLE FOR THE 'PROBLEMS' IN THIS SITUATION.

THE BOARD OF EDUCATION WILL HAVE TO PAY. NOW THEY WILL ALSO HAVE TO ANSWER AGAIN AT ELECTION TIME.

--posted by A gu est @ Sunday, July 6 2003, 11:36 am EDT

I just reviewed this page and as a member of the Jewish faith, I find the terrible words and comments of Cretin offensive. His use of disgusting terminology and the following "defense" of himself the lowest.

"God, Blair gives Jews a bad name. Just to let you guys know, we're NOT all like her"
Cretin | 05.12.03 - 12:48 am |

Gee, Cretin gives Jews more than a bad name. Just to let you guys know, most of us are not like Cretin and abhor his thoughts and language .

--posted by The guest @ Sunday, July 6 2003, 11:53 am EDT

Gee, The guest and H give Jews more than a bad name. Just to let you guys know, most of us are not like The guest and H and abhor their thoughts and language .

--posted by cretin @ Sunday, July 6 2003, 13:06 pm EDT

I have yet to hear ANY of you dispute my facts. You have only *attempted* to hurt my feelings, and you haven't even done a good job of that.

Posting my messages to other boards here only serves to show how right I am.

Regardless of the self satifaction you gain, sitting there alone, and viewing all the boards you have posted to, ultimately, you are still... alone.

--posted by cretin @ Sunday, July 6 2003, 13:08 pm EDT

For all of you that read MM and DouglASS-Smith-Jones....is there a common thread of hate and sham authority that goes through their comments?

One defends plagiarism, if he likes the person who is doing the plagiarizing. The other spends hours writing elaborate posts that no one reads.

Both are full of opinions. But so far, no facts.

--posted by cretin @ Sunday, July 6 2003, 13:21 pm EDT

I think we should sue the BOE for giving special privileges to certain students. There was NO difference between Blair and me, except that she had a doctor's note saying that she gets tired. Yet one of us got to take any classes we wanted. One of us got to study at home.

This is clearly discrimination. We should sue the BOE, bankrupt Moorestown, and take over.

--posted by cretin @ Sunday, July 6 2003, 13:38 pm EDT

In the spirit of intellectual diversity, I think everyone except ME should be banned from this message board.

And in response to the allegations of plagiarism, I would like to take this opportunity to respond. I was recently advised by DouglASS-Smith-Jones that I had not properly cited my sources for posts that I submitted to this message board. These voluntary posts were not written for class assignments. I kept notes on what I had read. When finalizing my thoughts, I, like most every teenager who has use of a computer, cut and pasted my ideas together. Since there was no place for footnotes, I decided not to attribute my ideas to those who originally created them. But please remember, I am not a professional message board poster. I am now cognizant that my actions are controversial. But I stand by them and will not apologize.

Thank you and god bless.

--posted by cretin @ Sunday, July 6 2003, 14:32 pm EDT

http://www.southjerseynews.com/issues/june/m061303e.htm

--posted by cretin @ Sunday, July 6 2003, 14:34 pm EDT

A testement to un orginal thinking, and further proof that regardless of the what, the who, (in this case, Cretin), is still and remains... an idiot.

--posted by old news @ Sunday, July 6 2003, 17:40 pm EDT

A testament to unorginal thinking, and further proof that regardless of the what, the who, (in this case, old news), is still and remains... old news

--posted by cretin @ Monday, July 7 2003, 7:53 am EDT

old news, why do you think Blair is an idiot? Do you even know her? Didn't you mother ever tell you that it isn't nice to call people names. Especially the disabled. God knows they need those special breaks.

--posted by cretin @ Monday, July 7 2003, 8:53 am EDT

Cretin's IP Addresses have been blocked from further posting.

-adam

--posted by Adam @ Monday, July 7 2003, 13:09 pm EDT

Well, I hope it's not me, but if it is, oh well...

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Monday, July 7 2003, 14:34 pm EDT

Thanks Adam. Now we possibly have something to write and argue about besides him.

--posted by Mrs. M. M. @ Monday, July 7 2003, 16:48 pm EDT

my bad Adam, talk about dyslexic reading... I read Cretin's IP Addresses as "certain addresses". Sorry man, I'm really gonna go get my eyes checked.

--posted by S. Douglas-Smith @ Monday, July 7 2003, 17:20 pm EDT